Venting/need insight please - Russian Ukrainian Belarus Travel Music Woman Dating News

	The Russian Meeting Place: A place to meet people and talk about all things Russian... International Discussions about Russia, Ukraine, Belarus, Travel, Music, Russian News, Ukrainian culture, Belarusian Dating, Moscow, Saint Petersburg, Kiev and other intelligent topics about life in the former Soviet Union.

Pages: 1

Venting/need insight please
(Click here to view the original thread with full colors/images)

Posted by: mahaya

Hi yall! I just registered today, but I've been reading numerous posts over the last month or so and I'm hoping some one will have possible insight for me. This may be long so I'm sorry. I'm 19 and I have completely fallen for this russian guy that I work with. He's 21. He's been in America for about a year and he speaks english pretty well. At work, we talk and we're pretty flirtatious towards each other. He used to invite me all the time over to his place to drink, but I'm really shy and uncomfortable being over there by myself (I trust him and he always has roomates and friends over, but I would would prefer to have a friend there as a buffer! I like using the "buddy system"!!) He doesn't ask me as often to come over anymore probably because I somehow dodge answering him. Other than that, he never asks me to do anything with him OTHER than drink! Everyone at work thinks he likes me and although I keep denying it, they all know I like him. My problem is I can't read him. I don't know how much of it is his culture or just his personality. He sends out these signals that he really is interested in me, but he won't ever make a move. His friend told me that he said "he doesn't know how he feels about me". I don't understand. I knew from the moment I saw him that I wanted to be with him. He's an amazing person and I've never been so attracted to anybody. I don't want to be one of those women who won't let go of a guy that just isn't interested in her, but if he didn't give me hugs, kiss me on my cheek, get me a Christmas present, do things to get my attention, and try to impress me I wouldn't keep trying to figure him out! I honestly don't know what he would see in me anyways. I mean, I've been over to his place about 4 times and I've hung around his friends. The type of girl friends he has are all russian and they're everything I'm not. I don't know if it's because they're russian, but they're so sophisticated, polished, intelligent and they have a different beauty about them. I don't know. I'm so sorry that I'm rambling, but I guess it's just me venting also. There are many more things that have been done/going on over the past 5 months I've worked with him, but this is already becoming a novel of a post!! I guess I'm just getting tired of this whole "chase/game" him and I have going on and am ready for some type of absolution. I just can't figure out what's in his head. How much of it is because he's Russian and how much of it is because he's a 21 year old guy? If he does like me, why isn't he making a move because he is a very straight-forward guy? Maybe he doesn't like me and he's just the worlds most fliratious/friendly guy ever! It would be so much easier if I hadn't fallen head over heels for him--despite my resistance!

Posted by: searcher

First, welcome to the forum!

Quote:

Originally Posted by mahaya

At work, we talk and we're pretty flirtatious towards each other.

Thats a good sign... if he weren't interest he probably wouldn't be flirting...

Quote:

He used to invite me all the time over to his place to drink.

Which seems to me that he wants to be more than just an acquaintance at work.

Quote:

He doesn't ask me as often to come over anymore probably because I somehow dodge answering him. Other than that, he never asks me to do anything with him OTHER than drink!

I don't know how long he has been in your area but maybe he doesn't know of many other places to go to or maybe he doesn't feel comfortable.

Maybe he need someone (such as YOU) to show him some things to do.

Quote:

My problem is I can't read him. I don't know how much of it is his culture or just his personality. He sends out these signals that he really is interested in me, but he won't ever make a move.

Men and women may always remain a mystery to each other. The only way you will "figure him out" is to talk to him, get to know him and then maybe you will understand him better but silence and avoidance leads to no0thing!

Quote:

I knew from the moment I saw him that I wanted to be with him. He's an amazing person and I've never been so attracted to anybody.

THEN BE WITH HIM!!!!!

Why the cat and mouse games???? When he invites you to his home, etc if you trust him then go! How will you ever get to know him otherwise?????????

Quote:

I don't want to be one of those women who won't let go of a guy that just isn't interested in her, but if he didn't give me hugs, kiss me on my cheek, get me a Christmas present, do things to get my attention, and try to impress me I wouldn't keep trying to figure him out!

If he weren't interested he probably wouldn't be flirting or inviting you over. There really isn't anything to "figure out". He is giving you all of the signs while still trying to be polite.

Quote:

I honestly don't know what he would see in me anyways.

That attitude is part of the problem. If you think poorly of yourself then you will never succeed! Obviously he sees something in you that he likes. I know it sounds like a cliche' but "just be yourself" that seems to be what he likes anyway and stop putting yourself down!

Quote:

I mean, I've been over to his place about 4 times and I've hung around his friends. The type of girl friends he has are all russian and they're everything I'm not. I don't know if it's because they're russian, but they're so sophisticated, polished, intelligent and they have a different beauty about them. I don't know.

I'm so sorry that I'm rambling, but I guess it's just me venting also. There are many more things that have been done/going on over the past 5 months I've worked with him, but this is already becoming a novel of a post!! I guess I'm just getting tired of this whole "chase/game" him and I have going on and am ready for some type of absolution.

He is waiting for you did he not ask you over? Didn't he give you gifts? Didn't he give you a [polite] kiss on the cheek?

HELLO! DING-DONG! RING-RING-RING! WAKE-UP!

Put your doubts away because those are what are interfering with your actions (or rather inactions).

Quote:

I just can't figure out what's in his head. How much of it is because he's Russian and how much of it is because he's a 21 year old guy?

I don't know if there is much to figure out.... and if there really is, I think its because he's 21 and not because he's Russian.

Quote:

If he does like me, why isn't he making a move because he is a very straight-forward guy?

I think he did... several times... but now he is backing off because he thinks you are not receptive to his actions and therefore not interested. I think he was trying to tell yoy this by his actions... the gifts and the kiss... he seems to be acting like a gentleman, after all, he didn't just kiss you on the lips without your consent nor did he act inappropriately when he invited you over.

Quote:

Maybe he doesn't like me and he's just the worlds most fliratious/friendly guy ever! It would be so much easier if I hadn't fallen head over heels for him--despite my resistance!

And see, once again your doubts are showing again.

Ask yourself this, if you did all of the things that he did and he didn't respond to your gestures, wouldn't you eventually back off????

Well, as I see it, thats what he's doing now! Backing off.

You want him????? GO GET HIM!!!!!

Just my thoughts...

Posted by: Keith In Kodiak

He's probably uncomfortable and unsure of how to proceed - just like you.
Help the guy out! The next time he asks you over for a drink, tell him you're not much of a drinker but there's a movie (play, concert, NASCAR race, football game, jello wrestling, whatever) that you've been dying to see.

Now you've set the bar a little higher but if he's genuinely interested he'll get the message and know how to proceed. If he drops it then you're better off.

Posted by: mahaya

thank yall for replying. okay here's the thing. I would love to go over to his place when he invites me IF his roomates and all of his friends weren't there. Don't get me wrong, they have always been extremely hospitable and very friendly towards me, but I would feel more comfortable for it to be just him and I. Also, he drinks all the time. That's fine, but I would like to be with him in a more sober state (although he handles alcohol pretty well). I have invited him to go out a couple times. He kinda invited himself over for Thanksgiving then backed out and about a week ago I invited him to go out to dinner with a friend and I but he said he was busy doing laundry. The next day he apologized and said the next time we go out, call him, and he'll be there. So I attempted a couple times because I understand that I'm shy, but he wasn't able to come. I'm completely new to this area so he would know more things to do than I would. In regards to the gifts...he told me he had never received a Christmas present before so I went out and got him something small. See, I was trying to set the bar a little higher and show him that I'm intereted (in case it wasn't obvious to him) by inviting him out a couple times and by giving him a small gift. Also, I'm not cool with being the first one to express my feelings. His friend told me that he's used to girls chasing after him and being the first to make the move and I don't do that. I don't know...it shouldn't be that complicated!! Somehow though it's turned into some type of game. At first it was fun. I mean I love a challenge and the whole mystery of getting to know someone. Usually when that phase ends, I get bored and I no longer want to be with that person, but with him it's different. I'm sorry, this post wasn't meant for me to vent my relationship problems. I was told by a couple of his friends that he is a russian boy through and through and he would act and behave differently than the American guys I'm used to. I've never meant anyone like him. I thought that may be where the whole "him being russian" might come into play. And in case that somehow got lost amongst my ramblings, that's the point to my posts. The whole situation with him leaves me confused, frustrated, but always wanting more. His friend tells me that he is difficult when it comes to relationships and he doesn't know what he wants. He better figure it out soon because I'm tired of waiting.

Posted by: EasyTarget

Mahaya:
This time of the year you have a perfect opportunity to sort everything out. New Years Eve. Somehow, someway I am sure you know someone doing something. Invite him along and if by midnight you don't have your answer, then you never will.

Posted by: Keith In Kodiak

Russians, particularly men, can have a very different outlook on alcohol. I'd sure be careful before getting too serious with this guy.

My advice still holds - get him into dating situations where drinking is not involved. Going to his place and drinking (whether his friends are there or not) is not a date. If he values you he won't have a problem taking you out to dinner and a movie.

Posted by: searcher

I 2nd what Keith and easyTarget have said.

I would be careful about the alcohol as well.

Now as for the "Russian" thing... Understand that Christmas in Russia is quite differnet than it is here. First, in Russia Christmas is January 7th. Second, New Years is the biggest holiday there and the day they exchange gifts, so if you want to impress him, try giving him something for New years

His friends are probably right in regards to women chasing him. I can only speak from my experience but the Russian women I have met weren't shy. If they were interested in a man, they let him know. He is probably still accustomed to this and that may be why he seems to be distant.

I know it may not be typical of you but if you are really interested in him, then you may have to be the one that does the persuing!

Good luck!

Posted by: Pin Boy

hello and welcome mahaya

you say he drinks all the time and that's fine???? - i'd disagree and say that's not fine. as the others have noted, it's a good idea to take a long look at this before you're completely gaga over this man.

gosh, i wish woman would go gaga over me if i had such a big problem like that....SHEESH!

pin boy

Posted by: Khashyar

Hi mahaya,

Welcome to the RMP Forums,

I agree with what was said about getting to know him in a situation where neither of you are drinking. I think that many 21 year old guys have very strong sexual hormones, and you want to understand whether he is out for "fun," or whether he has a serious interest in you.

If he is not interested in doing other things with you (like seeing a movie, going out to eat, going to the zoo, etc....), then I believe that the chances are that he is really only interested in having fun.

Good luck, and keep us posted.

Khashyar

Posted by: GREGK

mahaya- In your first post you tell us you're shy and uncomfortable being at his place by yourself and that you prefer a friend there as a buffer " the buddy system". In your next post you say you would feel more comfortable if it was just you two and noone else there. Sounds to me like you don't even know what the hell you want so how do you expect him to? Grow up! You also stated that you like the challenge and mystery of getting to know someone and then dump them because you're bored. Do this guy a favor and leave him alone! Women (girls) like you are the reason so many AM are looking elsewhere for love. He's better off with a Russian woman.

Posted by: Jill

Quote:

Women (girls) like you are the reason so many AM are looking elsewhere for love. He's better off with a Russian woman

Constructive criticism is fine; insults are not. Let's keep this discussion productive.

Posted by: GREGK

Read her posts carefully and then tell me if I am wrong. This poor guy is getting set up for a fall as soon as she can figure out how to do it. She already admits this is a game to her and he is frustrating her by not playing it right.

Posted by: BradIL

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jill

Constructive criticism is fine; insults are not. Let's keep this discussion productive.

Hey Jill... I agree with your post... and I am not looking to start a flame-thrower contest across this thread... but GREG and searcher have made some great points.

IMHO... a 19 year old woman will learn a valuable lesson about gender roles and the challenges of a cross-culture relationship.

For starters... she can't sit back and wait to be "pursued". The cat-and-mouse game searcher mentions, what GREG has pointed out. I know the discovery element excites this 19 year old, but in some instances, she will have to take the initiative to cultivate the relationship. From a guy's perspective... this can take some time and effort. Several months, in fact. But if the person is compelling... they will stay compelling over this period... and the effort will not seem like much.

If this is a fleeting interest... there won't be much substance to the relationship away. That's my experience.

Now... she is also dealing with cultural differences... and the differences in women that do exist! I know you believe women are women everywhere all over the globe... but her observations and self-doubts by seeing this man around other Russian women are worth noting.

I think searcher... and indirectly GREG... are both encouraging her to think the matter through a little more closely.

Posted by: mahaya

Okay, can I explain a little? Yes, I would and have been shy and uncomfortable when I am around all of his friends when they are all drinking and speaking russian (despite their best efforts to only speak english) and they all know each other. I'm pretty much the only sober, fluent English speaking, American there. However, I would feel much more comfortable and more open if it were just him and I or a much smaller group of people. If I had a friend with me, being around a bunch of people I don't really know and who are all drinking wouldn't be as uncomfortable for me.
Gregk, you're right, I'm not exactly sure what I want. I have a lot of trouble getting close to anybody--especially men. All I know is that I feel strongly for him and I think that it IS time that I grow up and take a chance. I've never had a serious relationship before. I would never let it go that far. So what I'm saying is: that I've never had anbody I could really "dump" once I got bored. When I said that I would lose interest in a guy and then move on, it's basically innocent. We would go out on dates, hang out, just have fun, no expectations--basically just being young, meeting and dating new people. But if they ever wanted anything serious, I would THEN move on. Now, I've moved to a new place, have met completely new people, I'm on my own and away from certain situations--I feel like this is the time when I should grow up, take a risk, and see where it may or may not take me. When I first started developing those *warm, fuzzy feelings* for him, my first thoughts weren't "hmmm..a new challenge". I knew I wanted to get to know and be with him instantly. Over time, he started to challenge me and the things that I thought and beliefs I held--and I love that--but even without all those things that I find oddly intriguing, I could never get bored with him. He's too much fun with so much heart and personality. You know, I don't really feel like I need to validate my feelings for this guy so any of yall will think it's "real". I know what I feel, I just have never felt this way so I don't know what to do with myself! Also Gregk, you may be right again. I've had a feeling that I wouldn't be good enough for this guy. I would look at him with his russian girl friends and think to myself "him and her make a lot more sense than him and I". It hurts thinking that you're not enough to make a person you care about happy, but if him and I were to ever be together, I sure as hell would try my best.
Maybe I shouldn't have emphasized the drinking, but he really is not an alcoholic! Yes he does drink a lot, but he's not a problem drinker. Before I moved here, I drank just as much as he does, but now I'm trying to focus on school, work, etc.... instead of partying for now. Plus, I'm from the south where drinking is a way of life. He should feel right at home.
Like I said, I'm not going to validate myself. But I posted asking for input and I thank everyone for giving me their time and thoughts. Thank you!

Posted by: searcher

Quote:

Originally Posted by mahaya

I would feel much more comfortable and more open if it were just him and I or a much smaller group of people. If I had a friend with me, being around a bunch of people I don't really know and who are all drinking wouldn't be as uncomfortable for me.

Understandable and all the more reason to try to get him to go out with you - away from that enviroment.

Its easy for him to stay there because that is what he is familiar with. As he becomes more familiar with other things, he may be less inclined to sit at home and drink, etc.

Quote:

Gregk, you're right, I'm not exactly sure what I want. I have a lot of trouble getting close to anybody--especially men. All I know is that I feel strongly for him and I think that it IS time that I grow up and take a chance.

Good!

Quote:

I've never had a serious relationship before. I would never let it go that far. So what I'm saying is: that I've never had anbody I could really "dump" once I got bored. When I said that I would lose interest in a guy and then move on, it's basically innocent. We would go out on dates, hang out, just have fun, no expectations--basically just being young, meeting and dating new people. But if they ever wanted anything serious, I would THEN move on. Now, I've moved to a new place, have met completely new people, I'm on my own and away from certain situations--I feel like this is the time when I should grow up, take a risk, and see where it may or may not take me. When I first started developing those *warm, fuzzy feelings* for him, my first thoughts weren't "hmmm..a new challenge". I knew I wanted to get to know and be with him instantly. Over time, he started to challenge me and the things that I thought and beliefs I held--and I love that--but even without all those things that I find oddly intriguing, I could never get bored with him. He's too much fun with so much heart and personality. You know, I don't really feel like I need to validate my feelings for this guy so any of yall will think it's "real". I know what I feel, I just have never felt this way so I don't know what to do with myself!

Its not necessary to validate anything with us BUT i'm glad to see that you feel he is not just someone you have a temporary interest in, someone you could easily become bored with.

If you feel deep in your heart that you REALLY want to be with him and you are aware that its not just some type of temporary entertainment then [if it were me] I would persue it!

Quote:

Also Gregk, you may be right again. I've had a feeling that I wouldn't be good enough for this guy. I would look at him with his russian girl friends and think to myself "him and her make a lot more sense than him and I". It hurts thinking that you're not enough to make a person you care about happy, but if him and I were to ever be together, I sure as hell would try my best.

Two things....

First, as long as you keep telling yourself you're not "good enough" you never will be. Obviously, there was something about you that caught his attention... so maybe you're god enough FOR HIM! ok?

The only significant difference I see is that in general typical Russians are better educated than the typical Americans. They get more and earlier exposure to foreign languages, arts and other cultural events.

Find out what he likes, offer to do those things with him (and maybe you'll find something you like too or maybe you'll learn something new).

I guess this is also what I like about Russians too because i'm the type of person that enjoys art and museums, etc...

Second, you say you will try your best. Good because that is what you will have to do. No relationship comes without work! When one or both people in a relationship give up or become lazy, that is when the relationship is at its worse. I won't go into great detail here as i'm not an AW basher but I remember what a Brazilian friend of mine was saying about an AW that asked her why do "you girls (meaning foreign women) come here and steal our men". She told her that she didn't persue him, he persued her. After much conversation, this woman asked for her help with her own marriage. I'll summarize - everyone wants love, attention and affection. When those things are neglected, the relationship suffers. Everyone has needs, when those needs aren't met people become dissatisfied, simple?

For him, you just have to be his friend, companion, lover, etc.... Some people never understand that when they marry their spouse is the new best friend. They spend all of their time away and neglect their spouse. Now, I do want to be careful because everyone need some time to themselves (as my ex-wife literally chased away all of my friends because of her psychological issues). I didn't neglect her, etc but she had to have absolute control and it literally became a dangerous situation!

In short, be his best friend and always be available! That is good enough.

Quote:

Maybe I shouldn't have emphasized the drinking, but he really is not an alcoholic! Yes he does drink a lot, but he's not a problem drinker. Before I moved here, I drank just as much as he does, but now I'm trying to focus on school, work, etc.... instead of partying for now. Plus, I'm from the south where drinking is a way of life. He should feel right at home.
Like I said, I'm not going to validate myself. But I posted asking for input and I thank everyone for giving me their time and thoughts. Thank you!

We understand about the drinking... as it is more common in Russia than it is here, we just want you to be careful in the event that it is or is becoming a problem.

Posted by: Jill

Quote:

but GREG and searcher have made some great points.

Yes, they have (as have you). I was fine with Greg's post up until the last line (the one that I quoted). I thought that comment was a little unnecessary. But let's just carry on now.....

Posted by: B82

You know what? If you like him, tell him. Before I began dating my now husband, I was soooo afraid to tell him how much I liked him. But a friend told me that the worst he can say is "No". I took as my cue and I wrote him a note because I was too shy to tell him myself. To make a long story short, he liked me too!! He also told me that he would not have made the first move because he was too shy. So somebody had to wear the pants in this situation

About the drinking, you might want to be careful. It's fine now because you don't really know him, but it could become a problem later. My guy doesn'd drink and doesn't smoke and neither do I. He did tell me that Russians like to drink generally speaking. It's fine to drink, you just don't need to get drunk. If you want to spend time with him alone, invite him to do something. Maybe have him come to your house because that way, his friends can't tag along. What I really think you should do is ask him if he is feeling you because if he isn't, then you can just communicate as friends. If he does like you (since you like him) tell him that you would like to spend some one on one time with him. See what he says. Remember, the worst he can say is "No" and it is not the end of the world (though it may feel like it).

Posted by: Hostile_hostage

I agree with B82.
Wear your heart on your sleeve.
Write a letter telling exactly how you feel.
You could also write about anything that worries you.
What have you got to lose?

Posted by: B82

Also, Mahaya, I know it may be hard but you should pull him to the side and just say, "Look, what are we because I feel that I am getting mixed signals". That would clear up the air. Who has the time for runarounds? My guy would have never told me that he liked me so I decided to put all my nerves to use and something amazing came out of it. I wish you good luck.

Posted by: martin3030

Mahaya has not updated since 31st Jan ?

Looks like one way or another something has been decided !!!

Posted by: Samurai_Bob

Two young people with cultural differences yes.
And also both avoiding the possibility of rejection.

Dispite the physical attraction, I don't see the chemistry here strong enough to overcome the fear.

She has nothing to lose and all to gain by pouncing on him!

He may not accept her advance,and she is back at square one without him.

On the other hand, she may hook the man of her dreams.

Low self-esteem, and the fear of rejection will make her fear of losing him come true. She must go for what she wants.

This is kind of an old post, and I hope she gets her man.

Posted by: RBS

Mahaya

Go slo. Go easy.

Gib

Posted by: mahaya

Hello...

I know it's been a long time since I've posted--so I guess I'll update yall! Let's see, I was told by a mutual friend (she is Russian too) that he said he wasn't sure how he felt about me etc.... Anyways, sometime in January she told me (the mutual friend) that he told her he was considering asking me to marry him for a green card if his ex (who happens to be American) said no (and she did

A couple days later she told me that he decided against asking me to marry him because he values my friendship too much. We no longer work together because he has moved on to another job so I don't see him alot. Just last night, our friend told me he was wondering why haven't I called blah blah blah. This is the condensed version from what's happened over the last 3 or so months, but I no longer care! Yes, we are still friends--I very much enjoy his company: he's hilarious, full of personality, smart, and despite being extremely pretentious and an a** sometimes, I can tell deeep down he's a good person. BUT--it shouldn't be this difficult and exhausting to be with somebody when nothing more has been stated except a good friendship. Plus, I was pissed he was even considering asking me to marry him and that he asked his ex! Obviously once I found this out, I re thought what type of person he is. Now, I find it slightly funny. Occassionally I'll go over to his place and we'll watch a movie and just sit there and talk. Although I may still harbor slight feelings for him, I've definitely moved on! I know people say that I should have pulled him aside and told him how I felt, but I'm just not that type of girl. I believe if it's meant to be, it'll be. I would never put this much thought and try to analyze a guy, but when I had met him, I just moved to a new state, everything I knew was back home across the country, and he was the first person that befriended me. I was just taken by him. But I will not feed into his ego by chasing him. He's used to girls throwing themselves at him, but I am not one of those girls. Until he states otherwise, all he gets from me is friendship, but I think that's all I want to give!

Posted by: searcher

I think things worked out for the best.

In looking at what you just posted I think you have avoided getting yourself into a lot of trouble.