Impressive Scammer from Elena's Models - Russian Ukrainian Belarus Travel Music Woman Dating News

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Impressive Scammer from Elena's Models
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Posted by: jpierce55

Her name is Veronika profile#880682 since I can't link it. I have been emailing her for over one week. I have encountered a couple of other scammers but this one was really good.

Her emails are 100% responsive to my own, nothing could be from a form.(except this last one could be) What she says in her profile (personality traits) matches her letters, it almost makes me wonder if she modeled her profile off of mine. We had so much in common, and she talked about things that match my interests without me mentioning them first. I guess she is good at guessing. I think it is scary that she has taken so much effort to respond to me.

One other scammer I have encountered also responded completely to my emails, but she could not keep her story straight for very long (forgot where she was from). I think this "Veronika" is putting forth some effort.

As for me I am done with this thing, I have a couple of other women I am emailing and I will see where that goes, but I am done trying. To many scammers! In all at least I found a friend out of one of the women.

Last email:
Greetings Jason!!! You were right, yesterday I with parents all the
day long have stayed in a wood. We have left in the morning and have returned late at night. Weather yesterday has improved. Became little bit warmer. The snow at us does not go, but some last days were cold. At night the temperature fell up to 3 degrees of a frost. But since Tuesday warming is expected. Yesterday in a wood we have very well spent. If you will come to me, you will see all and will go with us in a wood. Very bad that at you bad weather. But I hope, that becomes fast she{it} better. In fact the summer is fast. Today I have cleaned{removed} the questionnaire from Elena's agency. I think, that so will be correct and fair in relation to you. I hope, that you have already made the same. Now let's discuss a question on reception of the visa. That you have arrived to me, I should make to you the invitation. Under this invitation you will do{make} the visa. To make to you the invitation to me the copy of your passport, data on your trade, the birthplace and a nationality and 200 dollars are necessary. So much to me will be it is necessary to make to you the invitation and cost of road from Grodno up to Minsk and back. Because in Grodno there is no department on affairs of foreigners where I could issue to you the invitation. It is necessary for me to go to Minsk. If you accept such conditions, I at once shall start to legalize papers. Reception of the invitation will borrow{occupy} 2-3 weeks. Concerning your residing. It will be very inconvenient for me, if you will live in hotel. You have arrived to me on a visit and should live at my place instead of in hotel. We shall be glad to see you at home. So do not worry about it. On it I shall stop. I hope, that weather at you has improved. I wait for your answer. Veronika

Posted by: Pin Boy

jp,

sorry you ran into another piece of garbage

put it in the trash where it belongs!!!

pin boy

Posted by: jpierce55

Already done! I have a thought, maybe this "woman" is one of the scammers I already emailed before. It might be why she new what would work to convince me? Does not matter. I am not wounded because things happened way to fast and that is a good thing.

Look at it this way, at least I did not have to worry long on if I should meet her!

It is my nature to have more concern for others, and I have contacted Elena's about it.

Well Pin Boy, I still have the girl from Uzbekistan and I do know she is real. (She is the one I mentioned not hearing from for a long time) I always did like her! It looks like correspondence will be extremely slow but at least I don't have wonder if she is real.

Posted by: Pin Boy

good for you...i know that this is frustrating but i am glad it hasn't cost you much money...good lessons to learn here on the RMp courtesy of lena and khashyar and all the forum members

pb

Posted by: Texas Proud

So let me get this straight....

You had been emailing her for a whole week and she was wanting you to come over and VISIT????

Even without being a scam... this seems very strange to me...

And, her profile is not available anymore... so it seems that she either was taken off by them or she was telling the truth about taking it down...

Posted by: jpierce55

She is not the first who quickly asked me to meet, but the others had explained they did not want another long correspondence with a man who will never meet them.(the claim that happened to them) That part is not so strange, it kind of makes sense. It also was not a requirement I meet them immediately, just that I agreed to meet them. The fact she wanted me to stay with her is the strange part.(I posted about the day before) Yes she removed her profile, I checked it when she sent the email.

I sent Elena's an email, the are looking into the matter and have restored my credit used to get her address.

Posted by: Ade

Hi,

How do you 'know' she's a scammer? Have you checked that she could get an invitation approved in Grodno? Have you suggested that it would be better for both of you if you stayed in a hotel first, and seen how she responded?

It seems that you're jumping on her a little too quickly. From what you say it sounds as though you may need to exercise a little caution - but there's no proof of a scam here, unless there are things you aren't telling us.

It's too easy to get paranoid, and also too easy to label someone when there's no chance of any comeback.

Ade

Posted by: jpierce55

Yes I did tell her it would not be possible to stay with her in the letter before, that is why she is making the point I must stay with her.

As far as saying I am jumping on her, come on she is asking $200 for a letter of invitation. Lets be realistic, she just happens to know how much it will cost her? She is going to travel to another city for a man she has only known for a week?

Posted by: Ade

Hi,

Maybe $200 is her estimate of travel and other costs? Have you looked into that at all? - I'd guess it's probably possible via the internet to get a rough costing yourself - or maybe someone on here has a rough idea.

As for staying with her, maybe she thinks it's a waste if you go all that way to stay in a hotel? Staying with her could be intense, but at least you'd get to know her!

As for travelling to do an invite, if she'd genuinely like to meet you, when is an appropriate length of time to wait? By whose standards?

I've been on the end of intended scams myself, including one that was long-winded and fairly pointless (but I got to meet some really nice people and one special woman), so I know they happen, and not infrequently over the internet - but it doesn't mean anything vaguely off-kilter is a scam.

Insist on staying in a hotel - and explain that it's best for both of you (and thank her for her offer). See what happens.

As Bertrand Russell said 'Of all forms of caution, caution in love is perhaps the most fatal to true happiness'.

Ade

Posted by: Jerico

You know i was always told that of all the men that write these women , only about 10 percent ever go to meet them.
So the women that write you back that want to meet you right away could really be real .
There just tired of the guys that write and write and never make the next step
Remember that it is difficult for them to maybe visit you.
Only you going there is the easiest way to meet them.
They just dont want a email romeo.
They want the real thing and a real man interested in datnig a russian woman will take the chance and go to visit them in person.
Jerry

Posted by: jpierce55

You do realize she asked for both my passport and money?

I do understand Jerico what you are saying. I made the comment above that she is not the first to ask for a meeting right off the bat. That has nothing to do with why I suspect her as a scammer. We have an unrealistic amount in common, she asks for money and my passport. I can't believe anybody thinks she would not be a scammer!

I think it is better I don't write back, that way Elena's might have a better chance to "investigate" her.(if they really do) I don't wish to tip her off.

I am not trying to be rude, I just don't agree with your opinion.

(edited because I was asked to remove the email address)

Posted by: Ade

Hi,

Don't know about Belarus, but in Russia, to make an invite, they need a copy of your passport; not the original, a good photocopy will do, but they have to have it. So says the Russian Consulate website, London. I'd not be surprised if it was the same in Belarus. Nothing sinister there.

I go to Bratsk in July, and from there, go to a camp on Lake Baikal; my friend has booked via a company in Bratsk, and I had to fax them a copy of my passport. Just how they work; don't expect it'll be getting cloned

As for having an unrealistic amount in common - what does that mean? That you seem to have a lot in common? Isn't that a good thing? How much do you really know you have in common after a short time emailing? - it's just the surface.

Ade

Posted by: searcher

I agree with Ade,

Why not write back to her, tell her you don't understand the process because it is different where you live.

Ask her why she needs a copy of your passport and the $200.

Give her an opportunity to offer a REASONABLE explaination.

You never know, she have a reasonable explaination.

Don't blacklist her just yet!

Posted by: jpierce55

Alright I sent a polite email in discussion about that, but I don't expect much of it. Keep in mind she demands I stay with her and that I don't email anybody else, and that if anything says something is wrong imho.

Posted by: Ade

Hi,

I've never been into web-dating (internet wife-sourcing?), but I'd think that, if you are even considering having a relationship with someone, you wouldn't be writing to others as well, in the same vein.

I know many do, but I can't really get that. It just seems like a shotgun effect, without putting too much effort onto looking at what may work.

If you want to write to someone in the hope of a relationship happening, surely you need to at least concentrate on one at a time - at least, that's my take. Anything else just seems a little disrespectful.

Ade

Posted by: jpierce55

Only if they don't know you are emailing others. It is typical to do so. I email up to three at a time, and make no secret of it, and none of them claimed to only be emailing me, including Veronika. However, two days after she said that she demanded I quit emailing the others. I did not, but did consider it and I have no idea why I would have.

I am glad I did not because I always liked the girl from Uzbekistan, her emails are like a bundle of sunshine.

Posted by: Ade

Hi,

Well maybe you should forget Veronika and try to meet the girl from Uzbekistan?

If you were seeing a girl, would you be happy if she was not only seeing you, but several others too? I doubt it.

If you have even an inkling that someone may be right for you - or even the inclination to find out - then surely they're worth your undivided attention for a while?

If it's 'typical' to write to several people at once, that doesn't make it right - no more than a majority opinion has to be the correct one.

But from your previously posted email, it does look as though you maybe flaunted a little, that you were writing to others. Maybe she didn't want her nose rubbing in it, or you being so blatant about it. No-one likes being told, in no uncertain terms, that they really aren't that special.

Ade

Posted by: jpierce55

Quote:

Originally posted by Ade
Hi,

Well maybe you should forget Veronika and try to meet the girl from Uzbekistan?

If you were seeing a girl, would you be happy if she was not only seeing you, but several others too? I doubt it.

If you have even an inkling that someone may be right for you - or even the inclination to find out - then surely they're worth your undivided attention for a while?

If it's 'typical' to write to several people at once, that doesn't make it right - no more than a majority opinion has to be the correct one.

But from your previously posted email, it does look as though you maybe flaunted a little, that you were writing to others. Maybe she didn't want her nose rubbing in it, or you being so blatant about it. No-one likes being told, in no uncertain terms, that they really aren't that special.

Ade

I understand what you are saying, it was exactly how I felt 4 months ago, but trust me it is typical, at least early on. I don't think I flaunted it to her.

I do have to say that if I liked one of these girls and they asked to go exclusive I would likely do it. I would rather have longer than a week of correspondence to decide. If the girl from Uzbekistan, Elena, asked I would not hesitate. I don't think she is ready to meet yet, but I would like to meet her. I did send her flowers, and before anybody beats up on me it was "friendly and sunny flowers" not "lover" flowers. And just to FYI she emails other men, I have no problem with that.

I will throw in another point about her, she has a great personality, I am sure I would be happy with her from what I know. I do know she is active and likes dance clubs, etc. and that means I might not be right for her. I have mentioned as much and she did not seem to care.

If you want to know the one girl I was growing very fond of insisted I did not exclusively email her, 3 weeks later she "dumped" me. She had good timing, she waited until after we had started making plans to meet.

I will also state in agreement with you. I received a new email from another nice girl today, putting me back up to three. All are nice, and all are real (honesty is a different thing) I am not capable of emailing them all for very long. I would rather break it off with the others before we got attached. Some people say you should wait until after you meet somebody but I don't feel that way. I don't like to hurt others or risk hurting others.

Posted by: Jerico

jpiece55,
I understand what your saying.
She probably is a scammer of some sort.
She probably is writing to other men but it is one of those topics thats hard to bring up

I had many woman write me and i wrote to a few.
My wife was one woman that I wrote to.
Were some scammers? Definately but others where real.
Maybe i just was lucky in finding a real one in Moscow.That made it easier to visit her.
All I am saying is that only a few guys visit these woman and they know it.
So maybe she is just testing you to see what you think about the money and the passport.
However I am leaning towards scam.
Good luck
Jerry

Posted by: jpierce55

Quote:

Originally posted by Jerico
jpiece55,
I understand what your saying.
She probably is a scammer of some sort.
She probably is writing to other men but it is one of those topics thats hard to bring up
I had many woman write me and i wrote to a few.
My wife was one woman that I wrote to.
Were some scammers? Definately but others where real.
Maybe i just was lucky in finding a real one in Moscow.That made it easier to visit her.
All I am saying is that only a few guys visit these woman and they know it.
So maybe she is just testing you to see what you think about the money and the passport.
However I am leaning towards scam.
Good luck
Jerry

You know that is the type of thing that I think hurt me and Tanya, she had other bad situations and she mentioned her fears a few time. It still makes me wonder if she got cold feet, feared she would be dumped, and dumped me insted? BTW I have read those statistics you mentioned as well.

You are lucky you found a real woman if you lover her, no doubt. I am done for now in searching, I am not going to quit with emails or learning about the culture, but I need to work on my book and the scammers have really ruined my trust for now.

The worse thing is I am choosing them. It makes me think the guys that are picking women by the looks might be doing it right, all of the ladies with nice profiles end up fake!

P.S. Maybe I will include a female scammer named Veronika that gets eaten by an umberhulk in my book.

Posted by: jpierce55

Her response:

Greetings Jason!!!
Has received your letter and very much was surprised. I counted you
cleverer person. You me excuse, but your money are not necessary for
me. They are necessary for registration of the invitation for you,
instead of for me. If you can receive the invitation to Belarus for
45 dollars I very much for you shall be glad. But it seems to me,
that at you it will turn out nothing. Anyhow, try and write to me
about result. It is impossible to count all people villains and
rascals for whom are necessary only money.
Yours faithfully, Veronika

As you can see, she is still trying to convince me for the money. It seems at this point it is the only thing she cares about since she mentions nothing else. It does not indicate anymore than the other email did. Even though I politely wrote the email I think most people would have sounded more offended.

Posted by: Ade

Hi,

I still think you're off-mark here; have you checked to see what costs she may incur in issuing an invitation to you; including any registration fee?

To get your invitation issued she will likely, as in Russia, be going through Govt Depts to get it approved, and there may well be a charge to her for their time. It's not unusual, it's just the way it is.

To her it may well look like you're getting cold feet already. There will be plenty of internet resources for you to look up what procedure she has to go through to invite you, and an indication if she's going to be charged for the privilege of inviting you - likely she will.

It's all too easy for us to label these women scammers; we're holding a lot more cash and disposable income than they are, and living in a different environment.

Hey, in Bratsk, I went ice-skating; to get the boots, I had to hand in my passport. It's a whole different world.

Ade

Posted by: jpierce55

I did as suggested and Veronika sends another email saying she no longer has a computer and if I want to communicate I should mail her. Interesting thing is before her IP showed as Minsk (not Grodno). The last two are like this, check out the origin:

Delivered-To: jpierce55:lycos.com@mail.lycos.com
Received: (qmail 16716 invoked by uid 0); 28 Apr 2005 13:55:51 -0000
X-Ob-Received: from unknown (192.168.8.42)by mta7-2.us4.outblaze.com; 28 Apr 2005 13:55:51 -0000
Received: (qmail 30749 invoked by uid 1001); 28 Apr 2005 13:55:47 -0000
X-Ob-Delivered-To: jpierce55:lycos.com@mail.lycos.com
X-Ob-Received: from unknown (208.36.123.38)by as7-3l.us4.outblaze.com; 28 Apr 2005 13:55:39 -0000
X-Ob-Received: from unknown (208.36.123.73)by as7-1e.us4.outblaze.com; 28 Apr 2005 13:49:27 -0000
Received: from tut.by (speedy.tutby.com [195.209.41.194])by spf7-13.us4.outblaze.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A403236F8Cfor ; Thu, 28 Apr 2005 13:49:18 +0000 (GMT)
Received: from [82.209.219.150] (account deleted by me)by tut.by (CommuniGate Pro WebUser 4.1.8)with HTTP id 48611516 for jpierce55@lycos.com; Thu, 28 Apr 2005 16:49:17 +0300
X-Mailer: CommuniGate Pro WebUser Interface v.4.1.8
Message-Id:

In anycase I am done with corresponding with her, my instincts tell me something is wrong.

Jason

Posted by: RobOhioGuy

Quote:

Originally posted by jpierce55
You do realize she asked for both my passport and money?

I do understand Jerico what you are saying. I made the comment above that she is not the first to ask for a meeting right off the bat. That has nothing to do with why I suspect her as a scammer. We have an unrealistic amount in common, she asks for money and my passport. I can't believe anybody thinks she would not be a scammer!

I think it is better I don't write back, that way Elena's might have a better chance to "investigate" her.(if they really do) I don't wish to tip her off.

I am not trying to be rude, I just don't agree with your opinion.

(edited because I was asked to remove the email address)

Uhmm I might suggest that there has been some miscommunication between the two of you.

First off when YOU obtain a visa to visit one of the countries in teh FSU you DO have to send your passport in to have the visa applied to the passport. Secondly, I know up until about a year and half ago you needed an invitation letter to enter the Ukraine. It may still be that way to enter belarus. And the cost of a visa to enter Ukraine is $180

It may well be that she was trying to explain to you what it will cost for you to obtain a visa to enter her country.

I know that sometimes what comes out in english and what they are actually trying to say are two different things.

I made the mistake of using one of the translation programs to send a short email to my fiancee and what I THOUGHT I was saying and what SHE read were radically different Thank god she asked me to resend the email in English and she had it interpereted

Posted by: RobOhioGuy

Quote:

Originally posted by jpierce55
I did as suggested and Veronika sends another email saying she no longer has a computer and if I want to communicate I should mail her. Interesting thing is before her IP showed as Minsk (not Grodno). The last two are like this, check out the origin:

Delivered-To: jpierce55:lycos.com@mail.lycos.com
Received: (qmail 16716 invoked by uid 0); 28 Apr 2005 13:55:51 -0000
X-Ob-Received: from unknown (192.168.8.42)by mta7-2.us4.outblaze.com; 28 Apr 2005 13:55:51 -0000
Received: (qmail 30749 invoked by uid 1001); 28 Apr 2005 13:55:47 -0000
X-Ob-Delivered-To: jpierce55:lycos.com@mail.lycos.com
X-Ob-Received: from unknown (208.36.123.38)by as7-3l.us4.outblaze.com; 28 Apr 2005 13:55:39 -0000
X-Ob-Received: from unknown (208.36.123.73)by as7-1e.us4.outblaze.com; 28 Apr 2005 13:49:27 -0000
Received: from tut.by (speedy.tutby.com [195.209.41.194])by spf7-13.us4.outblaze.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A403236F8Cfor ; Thu, 28 Apr 2005 13:49:18 +0000 (GMT)
Received: from [82.209.219.150] (account deleted by me)by tut.by (CommuniGate Pro WebUser 4.1.8)with HTTP id 48611516 for jpierce55@lycos.com; Thu, 28 Apr 2005 16:49:17 +0300
X-Mailer: CommuniGate Pro WebUser Interface v.4.1.8
Message-Id:

In anycase I am done with corresponding with her, my instincts tell me something is wrong.

Jason

hehehe I should have read the rest of this thread....

Jason, I think I was right in my original point. I think she was trying to tell you how much and how to apply for what you will need to enter Belarus.

Things over there are not like it is here. She may well be traveling to Minsk just to email you.

But if you're not comfortable then you should move on. But I really dont see anything that screams scammer.

Posted by: jpierce55

I could be off-base in my judgement, it seems to be the general opinion.

Even if she is not a scammer it is to fast for me, I am looking for the woman I want to marry, but I am not ready to jump right in either. I have financial plans in development, and as you probably read I am making low pay for a few months while I am considered "in training". I can't afford to jump right in.

I don't want to quit emailing the girl from Uzbekistan either, and that is the major issue. I am not ready to give up what I consider a chance at something good. With either it is a gamble, but I know Elena better and I was really delighted when she began emailing me again.

The fact is if a gun was pointed at my head and I had to choose between Veronika and Elena, I would choose Elena. So it seems the way I should go.

My final reason to stop emailing her is your reasoning Rob, I don't feel comfortable (scammer or not) and as long as I feel that way no relationship can develop.

If she did not insist I email only her it might be different.

Posted by: Ade

Hi JP,

It is of course, your choice what you do here; but regardless of how many people say it's okay to mail multiple people, if you are considering a relationship with anyone, regardless of where they are, you want to be the only person they are considering; and you should want to be in the situation where they are the only person you want to consider.

Just because it's via email doesn't change that there are real people involved, with real feelings - and really getting hurt; if you choose to call things off with Veronika, please let her know - I get the sense you're decent enough to do that.

And good luck!

Ade

Posted by: jpierce55

Ade,

Nothing ticks me off more than all of the people who just quit emailing. It is so disrespectful! Even Tanya, after 3 months of emailing, just quit. Ffinally I sent an SMS asking and she admitted it. Now she wishes to be friends, and I am o.k. with that.

But I tell you, I admire strength in people. I can't tolerate weakness at all. Nearly anybody that knows me well will tell you I am a leader, despite a quiet disposition.

The one thing I can say is if they just quit it tells me we could never have been.

Posted by: inlove

Quote:

Originally posted by Ade
Hi JP,

It is of course, your choice what you do here; but regardless of how many people say it's okay to mail multiple people, if you are considering a relationship with anyone, regardless of where they are, you want to be the only person they are considering; and you should want to be in the situation where they are the only person you want to consider.

Just because it's via email doesn't change that there are real people involved, with real feelings - and really getting hurt; if you choose to call things off with Veronika, please let her know - I get the sense you're decent enough to do that.

And good luck!

Ade

Ade, I've been reading your posts in different threads for a while, and always meant to comment, but never got around to do it.
You are one of the most sincere and intelligent men on this board. It is very delightful to see that somebody, actually, understands how to treat other people right. I wish you the best of luck with you pursuit, and I'm quiet sure, you going to find a person who will appreciate your fine qualities.
Thank you.

Posted by: Pin Boy

geez! what about good ol' pin boy??? i even looked at your photos...

Posted by: inlove

Best of luck to you too, Pin boy, of course.

Posted by: Pin Boy

of course!

huge party at my house next saturday night for those inclined! come one, come all!!!!

pb

Posted by: jpierce55

We have near confirmation.

One: this morning I received an email hinting she either needs money for an internet cafe or I should send her my address and she can mail me. (not the other way around)

Two: Elena's has removed her profile they hint (but not bluntly state) that she has asked other men for the money. They checked her out and she is real, but she will not respond to their phone calls or emails. Their indicated opinion, she is not honest.

They have not blacklisted her yet, but she is running the risk. If/when I find out for certain I will post again.

Posted by: dakotaridge

Quote:

Originally posted by jpierce55
Her name is Veronika profile#880682 since I can't link it. I have been emailing her for over one week. I have encountered a couple of other scammers but this one was really good...

AAAARRGGH!! Don't be so quick to give up!!! Dude, THIS is why you want the small, localized agencies that are not networked. Elena's Models is a high-volume agency that goes to great lengths to have as little contact as possible with either clients or women. They just want to kick back, remain insulated, and have the money roll in. This is why the scammers flock to Elena's - because they know nobody is monitoring them!

I have had 100% good experiences with allbeautiful(dot net), cindyagency, and meetrussianbride. My I-wish-I-had-a-clue-where-things-are-and-where-they're-going might-be-maybe-possibly-could-be-future-fiance Ol'ya manages an agency at slavonianwomen which is also very localized. For some reason the best agencies seem to center around Kharkov, Dniepropetrovsk, and Zaporozhye. You just need to put more effort into finding these places - the ones I've mentioned are only a few; there are more. Don't rely on Google - the agencies showing up on Google are the high-money, high-commercialization ones; exactly the ones that are so automated that the scammers flock to them because they KNOW they can get through. In my opinion, AFA is so huge and so overpriced that I wouldn't even waste time going there. That's my opinion. Bestcupid, aarens, and MANY others are expansive directories of dating sites and there are a good number of sites - primarily the ones you really want - that will only be found listed in these directories. Look for the localized ones. And avoid like the plague any indication of money-money-money, such as "you can't look at the pictures until you pay us." I see that and I'm out the door.

You've just overcome a huge hurdle. This is called "experience." You're getting to know where to search, where to avoid, you're getting a good feel for the entire process. This is how you learn to navigate through all the garbage and get to the gems. Don't quit now!!!!

Posted by: jpierce55

I am not giving up entirely Dakota. I will continue emailing the other women I am communicating with. If it does not work out I may continue the search in a few months, and I will admit that is a maybe not a definite. In the mean time I will hang out here, read books, study the language, and learn more about the cultures over there.

I am trying to write a book that probably will not get published, but it is a dream of mine and I must pursue it or have regret for the rest of my life. So I will give some time and let this scammer situation cool down in my mind, but right now I don't think I can be trusting enough.

But thanks for the concern, and I appreciate the info.