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Russian girls are being abused and has to stop
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Posted by: iruss

It is a pity some few dazed people think they can tarnish Russian girls image by calling them scammers. So if a girl ask for internet cafe fees or mobile phone, she becomes a scammer. Men in the West buy their women gift and pay so much on a date so what is the big deal about Russian girls.

I spent 5000 USD on my Romanian wife even before her parent knew who I was. It is quite common there. You will spend more than 1000 USD before the parents invite you home. You want a cheap woman, please go elsewhere or find a man?

Why should a Russian lady spend so much to communicate with you...? If you want her to contact you, pay her phone or net bills and if she thinks you are not the right man...goodbye!

The agencies in Russia have failed these girls. Many don't even know their photos are posted as scammers. They don't understand English and rarely use the internet. They are being abused.

I feel someone has to protect these girls from these terrible abuse. I intend to create a non-profit organisation from my base in Western Europe to provide some assistance to the Russian girls and for the foreign men interested in them. Our first assignment will be to have all those photos of scammers removed from those sites. Any person reporting a scammer should publish authentic information and provide his own details including photos, addresses and email addresses. The girls may contact us if they think they have been abused by these men and we can help them to have their photos removed or get legal assistance. If anybody thinks this is a good idea and want to join in please post here.

Posted by: fly4fun

I voted no simply because this could easily become a "he said, she said" type deal.

I'm thinking specifically about the on going war? between two large agencies on the net. Both accuse the other of bad practices and the arguments are compelling on both sides but the problem is the reader has no way to judge which is correct. If either of them is? Perhaps they are both guilty? Who can tell. You have people weighing in on both sides and the net result is, they both end up suspect.

Does an agency that works in the ladies best interest automatically become suspect as actually protecting scammers?
My guess it would and might actually have the reverse of the desired effect.

For better or worse the internet will always allow people the ability to slander people and nothing anyone does will cure that basic problem.

Bob

Posted by: iruss

To prove some points that most Russian girls are not scammers. Take a look at some photos posted at http://www.russian-scam.org/message.htm

Many seem to be American or British girls and some of the photos seem to have been taken in US/UK college/university campuses. Quite a few photos are familiar and you could find them on free photo download sites or peronal sites.

It's just amazing how some people could take the trouble to post these pictures when the scammers are not the Russian girls or the girls in the photos. The scammers are the agencies and some few rotten young lads finding a new avenue to explore or tired of playing video games.

The issue I want to drive home here is that a few (or if not many) real beautiful Russian girls seeking true friendship, love or marriage are caught in between this urgly situation and are being abused in the process.

Would you imagine posting American or British girls photos on the internet and calling them scammers what controversy and debate it will generate in the world. I bet you those making those allegations may have to prove it or they may be sued for abusing the young girls by their parent or the government.

I would rather suggest that anyone who has been scammed should make concrete investigation and report to the police. The mere refusal of a Russian girl to continue dating must not be a ground for posting her photos as a scammer.

What is the legal position? It is illegal to post these photos as it does violate the girls right to privacy and only the courts can prove them guilty of the offence. Otherwise, they are being abused and have the right to sue for damages.

I hope my statement makes some sense?

Posted by: AkMike

The main problems that I see is that the internet allows for people to change their names[ handles] and by simply changing their ISP a fresh address to go with it.
IRUSS, you haven't filled out your profile here. How would we know if you are indeed from "Western Europe" It's just a small easily faked something. If someone wanted to decieve it's easy.
I don't like the idea of someone getting used this way. But I doubt that any police organization will give 1 iota of effort to an investigation where they are'nt being physically abused or having money stolen from them.
And there are real scammers out there. Not all are scammers I'm sure but who's going to be the judge? Who's going to judge the judge? I'm afraid that however noble the thoughts it'd be an effort in futility.

Posted by: iruss

As I write this message, I am being scammed. Yes! Fortunately, the scammer is not the Russian girl I am dating but the gang that is controlling and directing her communication with me.

How did I know this? Read on....

I was contacted by a Russian girl through a dating site via my yahoo email. The first message did not sound like a letter from a female but I did reply anyway.

The next day, I received a response that sounded more like a message from a female. She attached her photo and gave me a long description of herself, her age (29 years), date of birth, work, family, friends etc. I knew immediately she was sincere so I pushed on by sending my photos, telephone and told her how nice she is etc etc etc.

The next letter I received did not sound like her and did not respond to anything I had replied to in my last email. It looked as if someone was writing for her while she was at work. No, I couldn't imagine her doing that but anyway I replied.

The next day I got a phone call from her. She introduced herself and after making her feel very relaxed I put some questions to her which she replied accurately that made me believe she was real. I tried to pity her about the phone bill and she said no don't worry, I am calling from a phone box.

However, I when asked her if she received my last photos, she said what photos? Did you send any photos? Oh, I will ask them!!! What, ask them, who? I asked her. What are you talking about?... and the phone went dead....someone nearby....the gang decided it's time to go so that was it...I did not complete the phone conversation with her. I emailed her 10 times to ask her if she was alright as I assumed someone may hurt her for being disloyal to them.

The next day, I received the usual emails that was not from her but from the gang. They wrote stupidly and sometimes as if they are in a hurry or on the run for cops. I always keep my emails down to few lines as I suspected the emails are not from her.

I was glad when my Russian girl wrote again, she sounded real and told me more of her family, her work, what her company does, her weekends, her friends and many more and she sent many more photos. Real natural photos...not model type ones.

What amazed me so much is that the photos she sent all had special features. They showed landmarks of places. Through those photos I could locate her work place and some large structures probably near where she lives. Even her curtains, the wallpapers, and her cat gives me some clue how to locate her in Russia.

Guided by this extra-ordinary lady, I have more information how to locate her thereby double-crossing the gang. She is mature, older and smart. In one of the emails, I informed her that I will drive to visit her in the summer but I am sure the message never reached her but she knows now that I will be visiting.

The gang will not allow this because they need a piece of the action.....MONEY. Well, we have been talking a lot. They have been pretending to be the girl and I just received the first hint of money. To maintain the girls privacy and safety, I do not want to provide details here.

Anyway, as I know the set-up of these gangs and how they operate, I will continue to talk with them but I will not send money. The girl will probably be barred from talking to me but that will not be the end of the story. I have mapped out my journey plans to drive to Russia to see her. My plans are so well laid out that I probably don't need a guide. All I need and have are her photos with the landmarks to locate her work place and/or residence and no guns for sure. Will I be attacked?...probably no. The gang won't even know I am there for her.

I am the type of guy who don't give up and the last thing I will ever do is posting her real pictures as a scammer when I have concrete proof she is not one. These young beautiful creatures just want to find true love, friendship and marriage but they fall into the hands of gangs that refuse to let go the beauties around them. Imagine someone coming first time for your young sister...men become lions and roar!!!

Scamming to these gangs has become a hobby...not really a sort of lucrative business. The girls know these guys in their neighborhoods, and sort of trust them as they provide little help with translations. Amazingly, some of the girls speak better English than the so called translators. My Girl speaks quite good English but somehow finds herself in the hands of these boys. This makes me suggest that the gangs control the internet cafes and they dictate what goes in and out.

They control the minds of these girls, making them understand that "they can't just have you so cheap, they must pay something so you have to let us deal with them on your behalf". These gangs seem to sit down in the internet cafes posing as surfers or translators. The girls either know them for what they do or are unaware that they are in control of what goes in and out of the internet cafe PC/Explorer.

In my attempt to get my girl away from these gangs, I set-up a new email address for her, they never let her use it. I constantly sent her the login details and luckily once she used it to write me and next day they barred her and since then its been Yahoo!

With the email address I created for her I was able to gather even more information about her IP, Browser, ISP and physical location. With that I figured out that her work place is about 5-10 minutes walk to the internet cafe. She closes about 4PM and replies to my emails between 4.15-4.30PM. She's never in a hurry but she tries not to miss the bus so that means she lives quite far from her work and the net cafe and probably there are no internet cafe near her residence as she does not reply on Saturday or Sunday. She told me she works Mon-Fri every week.

I am still on track with my girl and she has done very great. She has provided me with the tools to locate her and I am going for her in the next few months. I am studying the map for the 40-60 hours journey that will take me by road with my car from Western Europe to Russia. For me, it will be a thrilling adventure.

You may say I am crazy but you got to know that there is only one way to punch this guys in the face and that is never let the scammers defeat you. Though, they will always be one step ahead, smart guys like us will find a way to beat them to the game. It is really a game of hide and seek and the smarter you are the better you can win. I pity the young men looking for Russian young girls. These girls prefer older men and will more or less allow the gangs to fool you if you show weakness.

The older you are the more the girl will see you as a suitable partner hence be on your side. It's like what you see in the jungle where female animals prefer the male partner that can keep other young male at a distance. Young men could be scammed more than older men as the older men have more experience in dealing with tough situations.

What you are reading is a true story and my personal observations. It does not reflect the general view of the public or the police. The police is better at investigating every case involving known or unknown gangs or scammers. I would therefore advise readers not to assert that gangs exist in Russia. In my personal opinion, I consider any group of persons (students, translators or agencies) trying to use these girls to carryout these crimes to be gangs or scammers.

I will keep you posted on the outcome of my adventure. Happy Easter!!!

Posted by: iruss

Finally today, the gang (presumably an agency or translator) directing my Russian girl, has asked her to request from me 850 USD for visa/agency fees to be sent via Western Union immediately promising her visa will be ready in 2 weeks.

These gangs are unaware that my Embassy in Russia does not process or grant visa applications. Her visa application must be submited by me and processed in my home country and she will only be issued a visa in Russia (if approved).

Well, I still believe she is being mis-guided by these criminals posing as translators or visa agents. So, I have sent a letter "To Whom It May Concern" to my girl asking her to deliver it to the gang or agency informing them that I will not send any money via western union and she does not need their visa or translation services.

Her name and photos are not in the blacklist however, I sent them a list of sites displaying Russian scammers hoping it will remind my Russian girl of the consequences of her actions if she deos not stay away from the gang. I warned the gang to stay away from her and desist from causing her any harm.

I have promised her I will not post her name/photos on any site as a scammer because I believe she is not one of them. They are in full control of her mind and totally mis-leading her. I made them aware that I have a full description of her workplace and her home address and I will make arrangements to visit and take money to her or remit money to her via another means without the services of an agency or western union. I am hoping this will entice her to break away from the gang...if she is not owing them.

As you can see my journey with this Russian girl has just began. I know she is innocent and I am going for it. It is too early to give up the fight with these rogues. It's going to be a bumpy ride, you never know, I could be lucky and swing this through.

My aim is to prove that these Russian girls are being used and abused. Hopefully, she will be here one day to tell her story. I will keep you guys posted as usual...

Meanwhile, read this: http://www.russianmeetingplace.com/...p?threadid=3450

Protect the rights of Russian women: www.antidate.net www.lillavilla.com and www.podarokshop.com (protect russian women for free)

Posted by: FlashingEyes

Hey iruss it sounds like you know it's a scam but are still determined to figure out a way to give "her" your money! Well you are certainly determined! Just remember, "a fool and his money..."

Posted by: iruss

Quote:

Originally posted by FlashingEyes
Hey iruss it sounds like you know it's a scam but are still determined to figure out a way to give "her" your money!

Well, I just got a call from my Russian girl today. She called to wish me a "Happy Easter". She hadn't read all the emails I sent and won't be reading them until Monday or Tuesday.

During our telephone conversation, she confirmed that it was her translator that came up with the idea of requesting for money for visa. According to her, she is not quite ready to leave her good job to move to another country. She kind of found it very strange what the translator wrote for her as she never discussed with her about travelling.

She also informed me that the translator has access to her emails and sometimes replies on her behalf or relays the messages to her at home. She said the translator is known locally and she was introduced to her by a friend.

I made her understand her name will be posted on the internet if she ask for and receive money via western Union from men she dates on the net. She said there are rumours about it from the local girls but she's doesn't care as she never felt it concerned her.

She assured me that she has no intention of taking money from me as she has a good job and she promised to stop using the services of the translator or agencies. I encouraged her to write to me in Russian language as I do have a software to translate it.

I sincerely believed her and I now trust her a lot. I am planning a surprise package for her in the coming months. We are not just talking about little pocket money but more than that! She deserves it.

A mature approach has won the day for me rather than rushing to blacklist her name/photos as some inexperienced men do.

Anyway, I will keep you guys posted...as usual.

Posted by: Jutman

Hi

I not vot, because its a leading Q, and I care, but its something without the medias focus and the for major players, Russia, EU and USA its such a small issue. Its a no win situation.

My persoanlly investigation in this subject for some years ago gave this answer:

Many girls are gettting like 5-8 USD to take a picture and fill out a questionare. If they can find another girl(s) they will get 1-2 USD per girl.
Then the agency simple just write back to the men who buy the adress, and smart agencies make several agencies using same info, picture and then can sell the adress many times.
One time I read, it was average 7 times per girl of 10 to 15 dollar. The cost 6-10 USD, plus the time to downloaded. ( photograher, shoudl be able to handle up 100 girls in a day)

I even came a cross a story telling that the some agencies hire people with okay english skills and even install it at their home.

The solution is some reaserach and pay attention.
For me a blacklistet agency have this:
- Only adress in FSU
- No credit card payment.
- The girls pics are all from a studio
- They are all good looking
- Spartanic info about the girls
- emails, made at the agency.*
- a picture/info is found at several sites

* fictive example: agency: ww.wonderfulfsugirls.com
The emails girlsname@wonderfulfsugirls.kom

BUT
also good agencies has a problem. I have personal experiened that girls get absolute no information about what to do, and for that matter, they are told its like penpal club.

So yes there is a problem and its answer is: what do do? I don't know.

Posted by: iruss

QUOTE

"Womens World" agency (Lugansk, Ukraine)

I would like to share some information about a very corrupt agency in Lugansk Ukraine called "Womens World" I have read a few posts about this agency and just want to share my experience. I am not out to smear their reputation just because I have nothing better to do with my time. I also get a lot of email from people asking me about that agency because they felt let down. I know that you
hear of many agencies doing corrupt things. My name is John I'm 27 and live in the U.S. I travel to Ukraine quite often for business and to be with a girl I met last year. My girlfriend used to belong to this agency although we met on our own. She does not use this agency to meet men anymore, yet I have sent emails to her profile number on the web site and get letters from the agency that are supposed to be from her. The agency charges $5.00 a letter. I played the game with the agency just to see how honest they were. My girlfriend never has been called by the agency to come and read my letters but the agency sends me her photos and replies. My girlfriend says this why she never met any men through this agency. It is very sad that this happens. I know now that many of the girls on this agencies web site are real but the agency manipulates what goes on with the girls. I know Lugansk has a bad reputation but there are real, honest girls there that have no hope of ever meeting a man because of what agencies like "Womens World" do. If you think you are writing to a girl at that agency, chances are you are not. It is just one of the employees in a small apartment doing all the work on a couple of computers. I will not forget the look on my girlfriend's face when I showed her the letters and photos of her that was sent by the agency that she had not wrote herself. She actually cried because she really had no idea that kind of thing would happen. It is very sad. I hope this information helps those who are not aware of the agency and their corrupt business practices.

John

QUOTE

REF: http://www.womenrussia.com/blackpage76.htm

Posted by: iruss

QUOTE

Anasatasia Vetrova (Irkutsk, Russia)

This is my story about falling in love with the non-existent. And paying for it. Anastasia Vetrova contacted me on June 13, 2001. We have many conversations, and many emails. Then on July 26 I proposed marriage. She accepts. I went out to look at her profile, and it was erased. I thought this a message of a dedicated spirit. So I closed my profile, too. Ironically this was the same day she was blacklisted at this website, and I had no idea at the time that this site existed. Turned out, that was why the profile was closed. Bad carma, huh ? Murphy's perfect timing. Also, you might notice that at that same time the green solid base line dissappears from the email text. And although the emails are pasted, and you can't see the subject field, it was this same time her subject field changed "Hi my liked friend John", or "Hi my love John" to simply "anastasia" from then on. The English suddenly improved, too. Like coming from a different person using different software. I noticed these changes, but didn't take them as warning signs. My heart was like a butterfly.

Another warning signal I ignored is that Anastasia's profile never had a picture posted. I wasn't thinking fraud, I figured she just never got around to it. Now I've suspected it was so that the criminals could respond to different respondents with modified letters, and different pics. Another warning sign I recall, she said in profile her hair was black. All women are proud of and careful to describe themselves personally, and i should have been suspicious. Anastasia said she loves animals. I got the idea that she could bring her dog, Poboral, with her to remind her of Russia. When looking on the US customs website, I discovered that if Poboral had anything wrong with him they didn't like, they would either export or destroy Poboral. So I sent Anastasia, the animal lover, the news and told her we must decide to leave Poboral in Russia. And Anastasia, the animal lover, made no mention of the subject in her next email. Another warning signal missed. And the big one, the zinger that was right in my face.

Anastasia originally told me her Uncle operated a travel agency in Vladivostok, and would sell her the normally $1200 ticket for $890 (very convenient, as Western Union only allows max $899 wire transfers every 30 days to Russia) I didn't pick that up either. Here is the zinger. Anastasia, in Irkutsk. Uncle in Vladivostok. I email Anastasia, ask her to give me the name of her uncle and the name of his travel agency so I could wire the plane ticket directly to him. Her reply, "Mine the Uncle lives at us now". Now why would a man operating a probably prosperous travel agency throw all his stuff in a suitcase travel thousands of miles to live with poor relatives in Irkutsk ??? Guess what guys, in a lonely heart, love is an overpowering emotion. I think I now understand why battered women stay with abusive husbands. It's not all fear, it's a matter of not wanting to give up hope. You look past the beating in hopes the future will be brighter. You don't see what you're looking at, because love is blind. I never even worried about all of Anastasia's "terminological inexactitudes" In mid August I wired $250 for the visa. On August 23, I wired $600 toward the ticket to Anastasia. Now I'm up to $850, near the limit. I don't want to wait for Anastasia. her visa may be active now, and the clock is ticking. I enlisted my friend Tammy, our purchasing agent to wire the remaining $290 on August 29. She agreed. Thursday morning, Anastasia emailed, confused she hadn't been able to pick up the wire. But I had emailed Wednesday noon that the wire would be coming from Tammy. Thursday afternoon Tammy and I both emailed Anastasia, and gave Tammy's full name and address . At this time, we suspect nothing. I work 10 hour 4 day weeks, so sometimes I shoot the bull with Tammy from home to the shop on Friday afternoon, if she isn't busy. Tammy , interested in Russian cuisine, suggested I jump out into my search engine to look for a cookbook, a welcoming gift for Anastasia. I found one, ordered it. Then a brainstorm. A Russian-English translation dictionary. She can't run home from shopping to use the online translators every time she doesn't understand a word. So I searched. That's when I noticed Elena's site here. So I went in , looked around. Saw the positive and negative myths, that Russian women aren't super-woman nor are they dumpster-divers. I liked her attitude, so decided to email her, thank her for such a fine site, and relay my success story Not 20 minutes later, "John it is a fraud" and she pointed to the blacklist. Although the villains had cashed $850 of my money, they didn't receive the email about Tammy's data to pick up the wire for $290, until about 7:30 PM Friday Irkutsk time. After banks closed. We stopped the wire transfer. Elena's warning saved the last part of a terrible fraud.

Remember, guys, I wasn't taken in by a Russian woman. I was taken in by criminals. About the pictures, I can't prove one way or another, but I feel that the girl who's pics these villains sent me, is an innocent and kind lady, who has no idea her pics are being used in such a way. Indeed, she may be just as much a victim of this fraud as I am. Even after I found out it was all a scam, her pics are still displayed with pride on my toolbox at the machine shop where I work. I will not remove them. Maybe you know how I feel.

My wish for the scoundrels who perpetrated this scandal, is that they take my money, buy 100 cases of Vodka, go on such a major bender that they all die of alcohol poisoning.

John C. Richardson

QUOTE

REF: http://www.womenrussia.com/blackpage28.htm

Posted by: RobOhioGuy

Quote:

Originally posted by iruss

If you are married to a Romainain woman what are you doing writing, looking at or responding to single women?

Posted by: dakotaridge

Quote:

Originally posted by RobOhioGuy
If you are married to a Romainain woman what are you doing writing, looking at or responding to single women?

I was wondering the same thing myself...

Everybody loves to wave the flag, creating a crisis and putting one's self on a pedestal for riding in on a white horse and being the savior of the poor exploited victim. The situation just isn't that terrible. The entire range exists, from the best to the worst and everything inbetween, but it isn't a case of "the worst" turning up everywhere you look; the problem has not reached epidemic proportions. It isn't a case where every last RW is horribly exploited and without us knights in shining armor to save them, they have no hope for a future.

Overall, men are far more exploited because the money comes from us.

I found Ol'ya on Amazing Women. I wrote to her through them, during November and December, and knowing all their profiles are brokered, I just continued the letters and avoided looking for an alternative way of communicating. Then I finally arranged for a friend (married RW from Kiev) to call her, and I was given 3 email addresses for the agency Ol'ya manages. Since early January I have never been charged for a letter to her or from her.

Olya says: "In our short-term practice of running the dating agency I must say that there was no case when our women stopped writing to men without any explanations at least, mostly, men ceased writing our women and we had to explain them why that happened not knowing particularly ourselves why that occured. You know pretty well that there are millions of websites and millions of women with pretty pictures and it is hard for us, a small agency, to find proper agencies to cooperate with, to let the men notice our women. Then women come and wonder why nobody writes them."

So it isn't a case of exploited women everywhere you go...

Posted by: Texas Proud

Quote:

Originally posted by dakotaridge

I found Ol'ya on Amazing Women.

HMMMMMM.... I went to see if there were some nice women on Amazing Woman and got 'Her first lesbian sex' site

Then tried Amazing Women!! but got some site with Cybill Shephard...

Guess the site is not there

Posted by: dakotaridge

Quote:

Originally posted by Texas Proud
HMMMMMM.... I went to see if there were some nice women on Amazing Woman and got 'Her first lesbian sex' site

Then tried Amazing Women!! but got some site with Cybill Shephard...

Guess the site is not there

There's a hyphen between Amazing and Women. It's the same company and same database as Army-Of-Brides.

Posted by: Hostile_hostage

Organised Crime in Russia.................of course there is. The 'Mafia' doesnt just mean gangsters with an Italian background.
I would imagine the sex industry and distributing drugs are probably top of the list where organised crime is concerned.
Scamming foreigners..........perhaps this is not such a high money making venture.
I would imagine it is a fairly easy scam and that many men have fallen victim to these fraudsters.
I would recommend anyone looking for a partner from an Eastern Block Country to join a forum such as this one. Or at least to do a little homework/research.
There are thousands of genuine women seeking partners.
Unfortunately there are also those looking to make a 'quick buck'.
My advice would be to go with recommendations.
Contact sites that are rated highly and you should be half way to contacting a genuine, relationship seeking woman.