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Lena & I possibly moving from California (difficulties of an immigrant moving again)
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Posted by: Khashyar

Hello Everyone,

Lena and I are faced with a decision to perhaps move to the Washington D.C.- Baltimore area (to be closer to my family, as well as where housing is more affordable than in Los Angeles).

Lena and I have also considered buying something in the Los Angeles or Long Beach, CA areas.

At the moment, we live in an apartment in Hollywood, but I personally feel that we have outgrown our apartment.

I have a sufficient downpayment that will enable us to buy a condo (in Los Angeles), or a house or townhouse in the Baltimore/ Washington area, and so Lena and I have been talking over the past few weeks about what might be the best decision for us.

Before moving to the United States, Lena lived her entire life in Belarus in the house that both she and her mother where born in.

So Lena is understandably used to digging her roots into the ground of the place where she lives.

In the U.S., Americans are so used to relocating when they go to college or start a new job, that moving from one place to another has become a regular part of American culture. Most Americans are used to moving to a different city, meeting new friends, packing up all of their possessions and starting new.

But for Lena, the idea of leaving her good friends that she has made here in Los Angeles, as well as looking for a job in a new American city, feels almost traumatic to her.

Perhaps this is also because it was an all-encompassing experience for Lena to move to Los Angeles from Belarus, that she has become emotionally invested in her life in Los Angeles. I certainly understand that Lena doesn't want to uproot her life again.

We certainly have the option of buying a 2 (possibly) 3 bedroom condo here in Los Angeles or Long Beach. However, I feel that prices here in Southern California are over-priced, and I feel that prices here will go down 20% to 30% in Southern California in the next 2 to 4 years. I know that some people do not believe that the California real estate market is in a price bubble, but from reading articles and commentary every day regarding this, I do feel that the market here is probably in a bubble that will downwardly correct itself in the next few years.

So, since Lena and I have really outgrown the apartment that we are in now (that was good enough for me to live, but is too small for Lena and our life together), I feel that we are faced with one of the following choices:

1) move into a larger apartment in Los Angeles (and perhaps invest the downpayment that I have and buy something in the future, perhaps when interest rates rise and the prices in Southern California drop 20% to 30%)
2) buy a condo or apartment in the L.A./ Long Beach area (spend $300,000 to $350,000 on a place in Southern California where Lena and I can live for 5 years or more??)
3) buy a house or condo in another state of our choice (We could pretend that it is Christmas, and choose ANY state and city that we would love to live).
4) buy a house or condo in the Washington D.C./Baltimore area (where prices are lower than the Los Angeles area- especially in Baltimore and the outer Washington suburbs- and where my sister and parents live).

I know that my dad (who will be turning 68 this October) and mom would love for Lena and I to move back to the East Coast. My sister and husband live in Washington D.C., and my parents live near Annapolis, MD (which is between Washington and Baltimore).

I also like the idea of having a pretty comfortable financial position if we move to the East Coast. (In Baltimore, Lena and I could buy a 3 or 4 bedroom historic rowhouse for under $250,000, and in the Maryland suburbs of Washington, we could buy a 2 or 3 bedroom townhouse or condo for the same price).

In Los Angeles, a 2 bedroom condo costs at least $300,000, and I do not want to pay $450,000 to buy a house in the Los Angeles area.

So, we are really trying to consider what to do.

I want to be there for my parents, who are becoming older and who would really enjoy and appreciate Lena and I being there.

I have lived away from my parents and sister for 15 years or so, and I would like to deepen my relationship with them and strengthen our extended family. If I moved to the area, then I could spend a lot more time with them.

For me, I could work in documentary film in the Washington area, since the Discovery Channel and National Geographic are based there, and New York City is about 4 hours or less by train.

I know that Lena will feel a decent amount of stress as she leaves her very good friends and looks for a job in a new city and has to re-evaluate what her goals are.

Actually, if I had my very first choice I might even move to the Portland, Oregon or Colorado areas

...but I am trying to choose what would be tolerable for Lena, as well as what might be a happy choice for my family.

It is a difficult choice for us, and I feel that since I have lived in different parts of the country and know what life is like in these different areas, then the weight of the decision might be more in my direction than in Lena's. (Lena has told me a few times that since she wants to stay in California, that I should essentially make the decision, even though I am continually trying to involve her in the decision-making process about our move.

Another choice would be to move to a larger apartment (i.e., continue to rent), and then invest the money that I have for a downpayment and wait for another time to purchase something.

But, my spirit and soul are itching to move

Part of myself has already made a decision to move to the Baltimore-Washington area, even though I have to remind myself to reflect and search deeply until I absolutely KNOW what the right decision is.

In less than two weeks, Lena and I are going to be flying to Houston, Texas to attend a family reunion of sorts, and then we are planning to drive on the way back, taking 4 days to drive through Texas, Colorado, Utah and Nevada.

I used to live in Colorado, and I look forward to show Lena Colorado and the Rocky Mountains, as well as some other parts of the U.S.... Perhaps this will help her open her thoughts that there are other areas of the U.S. that might also be interesting to live.

I would love to live in Colorado or Oregon, but I don't want to just consider what I want to do, I want to also consider what would be beneficial for Lena and my family.

So, this is a decision that has been before Lena and I for a few months, and I want Lena and I to make the very best decision for our future.

Lena would like to start a business for herself (perhaps opening up a shop), and she feels that Los Angeles would be a better place for this than Baltimore. She also has some immediate employment opportunities here in Los Angeles that could soon bring her $50,000 or more per year.

But, the feeling that I want to be closer to my family lingers in my mind, and I feel that this might be the time for a big change in our lives.

I think that because of the low interest rates, and our downpayment, that now might be the right time to buy something and perhaps move.

Lena and I have several choices, and we are trying to decide which choice is the best one.

Khashyar

Posted by: Jill

Ah, Khashyar, and right as I was considering moving to California

All things considered, though--the DC area seems like your best bet. Apartments/condos are fine--but there's still nothing like owning your own house and really having your own space. And there is really such a large (and rather friendly) Russian community in the DC area that I'm sure with time Lena will make many new friends. And there should be plenty of professional opportunities for the both of you.

You'll probably miss that California weather, though

Posted by: Khashyar

...Thanks for your feedback, Jill...

It's ironic that both of us are considering what is the best place to live

Our considerations are a bit different, since your decision is partially based upon which educational opportunity is best for you, while Lena and I were faced with the decision to move because we would like to buy a house or condo....

But, both of our decisions willresult in major changes in our lives, and are a little bit stressful (especially for our spouses).

It doesn't help that Lena and I have a few different options that could practically work for us......

With these kind of major decidions where my intellect cannot find an obvious answer, I also try to rely on my instincts and guidance received through meditation.

Thanks again for your thoughts.

Khashyar

Posted by: chaika

Kashyar,
I think I know what you are struggling with. After living 15 years in the Bay Area, my wife and I (both born Americans) found ourselves in a situation where we had to move, but housing prices were just way too much. We had met in Chapel Hill and both of us liked the combination of nature plus civilization that is here, so we decided to do it.

After 15 years living in Chapel Hill, we have still not recovered our network of friends and acquaintances, but I am beginning to feel ok here. You are thinking of going to a place where you have family, which I would say is the best possible thing you could do, when you are on friendly terms with them.

The East Coast is not the West Coast, but it is just as full of excitement and places to explore.

��!

David

Posted by: Khashyar

Hi Chaika,

Yes, I lived about 3 years in the San Francisco Bay area (on the border of Redwood City and Atherton), and I enjoyed that area very much.

The East Coast seems faster and less interested in progressive ideas, trailblazing new ideas, etc.

But, I do believe that you can find good people wherever you live, and each person has to make a decision as to where to live based upon what would make them most happy, which area would give them the best standard of living, etc....

It is a little stressful thinking about bringing in income in a new area, and especially helping Lena settle in and adjust to a new city.

I will miss the Southern California weather, and Lena and I are actually considering buying a 2 or 3 bedroom condo in Long Beach California, which is actually one of the last affordable beach areas in the Los Angeles area. If we did buy a place in Long Beach or in the San Fernando Valley in Los Angeles, then there would be very little adjustment necessary, and it would be psychologically easier in many respects.

Part of what pulls me back to really considering moving to Baltimore is because I know that my parents would really love it if we moved there. My parents are helping Lena and I with buying a place, and perhaps I feel grateful and am feeling like expressing my appreciation by moving to live near them.

I know that a person should not make a decision based upon guilt or any kind of obligation, but I really do appreciate that my parents are going to help Lena and I buy something, and it feels natural for me to think about a decision that would make them feel good as well.

I care about my parents, and want to help them and be with them in their old age, although the wonderful weather by the beach (of Long Beach), the sunshine, as well as the fact that Lena and I could afford a 2 or possibly 3 bedroom condo in Southern California appeals to me also.

There is also a very interesting artistic area in the San Fernando Valley area of the Northern Los Angeles area called the "NoHo Arts Disctrict," or "North Hollywood Arts District" that is really being renovated and is turning into a very interesting place where artists are living. That area is roughly near the Warner Brothers and NBC studios.

So, we are faced with many workable possibilities, so we need to reflect carefully about what decision is best.

Khashyar

Posted by: rtking

Well, for my own selfish reasons, I'd prefer if you and Lena stay in SoCal!

Let me know if I can help locate appropriate housing!

Bob

Posted by: 5beaches

Hi Khashyar,

I'm new here, but I thought that I'd give you my thoughts. Has your wife ever been to the Baltimore/Washington DC area yet, perhaps to see your Parents? If so, what were her thoughts about the area? If not, why not go there on a vacation and let her see it first hand?

I lived in Manhattan Beach for a few years and I really liked it, lots of pretty women and great weather. However, the Real Estate I feel is overpriced for the same reasons that you mentioned above. Also, trying to get around on the 405 is an exercise in futility. Myself, if I ever would move back out there, I feel that I would probably head to the Palm Springs area.

Khashyar, you haven't been around your parents in long, long time and they certainly aren't getting any younger. Personally, I think that you should head to the Baltimore area. I'm sure that your wife would adapt just fine. She will have lived on the West Coast AND the East Coast, not alot of people can say that they've done that !!! Plus, if you do end up missing California that much, what's going to prevent you from moving back out there?

P.S. Discovery Channel and National Geographic are 2 of my favorites.

Posted by: Khashyar

Thanks for yoru feedback, beaches and Bob (rtking),

Yes, Lena has traveled twice to Maryland and Washington to see my family, as well as to see the Smithsonian and Baltimore....

I think her attachment to Southern California is very strong, since she has great friends here, loves the weather, and feels really settled in here.

Another option that I think that we need to consider is to invest the money that we have for the condo/ house down payment, and then rent a bigger apartment (a 2 bedroom place, for example), and then buy a place in 2 or 3 years, which is when several expert economists feel that the real estate bubble in Southern California will deflate and drop. This would take an inordinent amount of patience and self-control, since EVERYONE who has the ability to buy something at this time is doing so.

By the way, over the weekend, Lena and I saw some nice two and three level townhomes in the San Fernando Valley (which had two to three bedrooms) for the $360,000 to $400,000 range, but I still feel that you don't get a lot for your money out here, and the prices just SEEM overpriced.

About 24% of the new home mortgages now are being taken out by investors (which shows the volitility of the market, if 23% of home buyers are investors). Also, the PMI company has made a statement acknowledging the risk in the real estate market in certain parts of the U.S. and has stopped guaranteeing loans in certain cases: where a person has over $350,000 in loan debt, and where a person has mortgages in 4 or more properties.

So, Lena and I MIGHT just invest our down payment amount, rent a bigger place, and wait...

Thanks for your feedback, guys...

Khashyar

Posted by: searcher

It looks like many of us are thinking about housing, moving, etc.

I have also been looking into places to live. I will probably have to remain in Southern California but at one time I had considered Arizona.

Khashyar, I had been looking in the Long Beach and San Pedro areas too. Good choices.

I am also considering Lancaster/Palmdale but it is a bit of a drive, etc. It is at the top of my list right now.

I would consider other states but I have discussed this previously with

and her being from a cold area, she does not want to live where it is cold or snows

Otherwise, I wouldn't mind moving near my other relatives in Nebraska or Iowa

then I also have to consider job prospects and health issues conserning my mother and brother.

So, it looks like i'm stuck in So. Cal.

Posted by: Alan Chapman

If I was married then my wife's happiness and peace-of-mind would be the most important factors in my decision. Of course, I'm not as close to my family as you are to yours so the choice wouldn't be as difficult for me to make.

Here are some other issues to consider in your decision:

The Baltimore/DC area has the highest rate of crime and murder in the country. Los Angeles isn't far behind.

If you plan to have children, in what type of environment do you want to raise them?

For the same amount of money that you would spend on a home in either LA or DC you can buy a huge house on a big plot of land in many parts of the country with less smog, less traffic, and less taxes.

Posted by: Khashyar

Hi Mark and Alan,

Yes, of course Lena's happiness is very important. However, I don't think that Lena has enough information or experience about living in different areas in America, nor of the real estate market, to be able to know what a good real estate purchase choice would be. I have been monitoring and researching the real estate market in L.A. and Baltimore every day, and so I am trying to receive as much information possible about a decision.

I am also trying to think about the future long term happiness of our family, rather than a temporary anxious readjustment that would result from a move.

I would actually also like to consider Oregon or Colorado, both of which are much cheaper than Los Angeles, but Lena really doesn't like the idea of moving to a place where we know no one.

I'm also wanting to take a bit of a break from thinking about this decision, so that perhaps I can rest and receive a new perspective about it.

It helps to be able to talk about it here, share my thoughts, and also listen to your thoughts and ideas.

Yes, Mark, I have been told that Long Beach is the most affordable beach area in the Los Angeles area. I haven't heard much about San Pedro.

Regarding crime: I think that the risk of crime is something that you can minimize based upon which part of a city that you live, and what kinds of precautions you take. I think that crime is somewhat of a risk in most American cities.

From my experience, there are many areas in Washington D.C., for example, that feel very safe, and other areas in D.C. that I would not walk in in the night time, or even in the day. The same with Los Angeles. So, choosing where to live in a particular city is important.

I actually grew up in Ohio, and I thought about Cleveland, Ohio as a possible place to live, and I suppose that it is still possible. But Lena really does not like that idea at all

even though I have a cousin and his family who live there who I am somewhat close to.

I would love to live in the mountains somewhere, or perhaps in Oregon, but.... I feel that Lena would not like that.

Lena and I are going to be driving from Houston, Texas (where we are going for a family reunion of sorts) to Denver, Colorado, and then over the Rocky Mountains to Utah and then to Las Vegas before we finally end up back in Los Angeles.

I am hoping to show Lena some other parts of the country so that we both can discuss other options.

But, Lena and I are different in that I am used to moving to different areas of the country, and even enjoy the adventure and newness of it, and Lena wants the security of staying in one place. So, I am trying to be sensitive to both of our desires and sensitivities.

I used to live in Colorado, and I LOVE the clean living there and could live there again.

There are many factors to this decisions (which includes wanting to also be closer to my family) and so I am trying to reflect deeply and take my time to make the very best decision.

We may just end up renting a bigger place to live and then invest our down payment funds until we are certain of where we want to live.

Although I wouldn't want to prices for real estate to appreciate so much more so that our down payment has less and less relative value

(As you can see, there are multi-dimensional factors to this decision).

I just heard on the radio today about a new book called "Blink: The Power of Thinking Without Thinking," which argues that very good decisions are made by trusting our initial instincts (that are made easier once we familiarize ourselves enough with a subject so that our unconscious mind can put the pieces together and "know" what the right decision is. Perhaps I am doing that by researching real estate as much as I have been.

Khashyar

Posted by: Jerico

Quote:

By the way, over the weekend, Lena and I saw some nice two and three level townhomes in the San Fernando Valley (which had two to three bedrooms) for the $360,000 to $400,000 range, but I still feel that you don't get a lot for your money out here, and the prices just SEEM overpriced.

Heh Khashyar,
Welcome to the world of real estate.
These prices are the norm for the Sacramento area now.
People from the Bay area are selling their house there and buying houses here which drives up the prices.
Also traffic is much worse due to the long commute travelers to the Bay area every week day.
A vicious cycle of sorts.
I feel truly sorry for todays young people trying to buy a house now.
Six years ago I bought my home for 95 thousand which is worth about 300 to 320 now.
It was a hud repo and i moved into it for 400 dollars.

Good for me but bad for the new guys just starting.
My home is only about 1300 square feet.
A house in a rough neighborhood still will cost you around 250,000
I dont see the real estate market dropping off anytime soon here in my area.
In fact i want my wife to get into real estate here and try to get a piece of the action .
She was doing this field in Moscow but for much less money.

Jerry

Posted by: eireannach

Kashyar,

You might consider Missouri, particularly the city of Columbia. It
is listed as being one of the best places to live in the country.
It has a much lower cost of living, it's a university town -- for the
amount you have been looking to put out for a place to live in
either L.A. or D.C., you could have a really nice house with a
good-sized yard and a whole lot better air quality, less crime,
better prices, cheaper gas, plenty of things to do, and so forth.

Central Missouri might seem a little more like Lena's homeland,
and it would put you closer to your relatives. There are two
international airports in Missouri, one in St. Louis and the other
in Kansas City (I tend to like KCI better than STL), we have some
good lakes and other scenic places here in Missouri, resort
areas, good schools, and so forth.

When I was in the Navy, I got to travel around a lot, from one
coast to the other. In fact, I have been in 42 out of the 50
states, small towns and big cities (and yes, I've been to L.A. and
also D.C. -- I was stationed in CA for two years, and also WA).
It's not bad here at all...I like it well enough to have lived here
for the past 15 years.

Well, that's my 2 cents worth.

Posted by: fly4fun

Head for Florida.
2 hr plane flight from Washington and real estate is still not bad at all.. Get the sun and still be fairly close to relatives...
Plus your relatives will come visit YOU!
I live in central Florida and I'm about 90 minutes from either coast so I never miss the ocean.

Sorry but I wouldn't wish the traffic in Washington/Baltimore on anyone. Might be right up there with LA. LOL

Posted by: fly4fun

You've probably already seen these..

http://www.russianbaltimore.com/
http://www.russianflorida.com/
http://www.russiandc.com/

Bob

Posted by: Haze

Khashyar,

I was in a much similar situation as you, living in San Diego for the last 6 years, renting

Well, in November I made the decision and bought a house in Sarasota, Florida. My quality of living space has improved very dramatically. it also is a lot more relaxing of a lifestyle, which feels good right now.

I do sometimes miss all the action of SoCal, but I am still single. Most of all I miss my friends from out there. But they all talk about coming to Florida. People do geniunely enjoy visiting here....I hope to find a nice UW/RW and will be going to Ukraine for the entire month of August this year to try my luck...

The value of my home here has increased at a much more rapid rate that what San Diego is doing right now....so I feel pretty good about that. I look at this place and it reminds me of San Diego years ago....people are all complaining that it is spendy here but it really has a long way to go.....

I know what you mean about So Cal real estate being a scary prospect. I just couldnt see paying those prices for something that I had to talk myself into liking (far from the water). I felt it was peaking as well and I didnt want to be strapped with a $500K loan around my neck.

It took me all of 3 hours to find a house here I loved when I came to visit ($285K). Still has the beach and the sunshine, just a bit stickier this time of year. And you have to get used to the blue hairs. Lots of nice restaurants and a fair amount of culture. I think it is up and coming.

I have parents not too far from here so that is always good, I am getting lots more time with them.

So I wish you luck, just wanted to give you my perspective on this recent move. I would be happy to talk about it with you further.

Jeff

Posted by: Colochef

Colorado is Great. I moved here about 5 years ago after living on both coasts and you couldn't blast me out with dynamite!!!

Posted by: Khashyar

Hi eireannach,

Welcome to the RMP Forums...

My dad actually went to college in the 1950s in Hannibal, Missouri....

And we used to have some family in Springfield.

I don't know if you have read my most recent thread, but Lena and I are buying a house in Baltimore, Maryland, to be closer to my family, who live near Annapolis, MD and also in Washington D.C.

I would love to live in the mountains again in the future if Lena would feel comfortable with that.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Khashyar

Quote:

Originally posted by eireannach
Kashyar,

You might consider Missouri, particularly the city of Columbia. It
is listed as being one of the best places to live in the country.
It has a much lower cost of living, it's a university town -- for the
amount you have been looking to put out for a place to live in
either L.A. or D.C., you could have a really nice house with a
good-sized yard and a whole lot better air quality, less crime,
better prices, cheaper gas, plenty of things to do, and so forth.

Central Missouri might seem a little more like Lena's homeland,
and it would put you closer to your relatives. There are two
international airports in Missouri, one in St. Louis and the other
in Kansas City (I tend to like KCI better than STL), we have some
good lakes and other scenic places here in Missouri, resort
areas, good schools, and so forth.

When I was in the Navy, I got to travel around a lot, from one
coast to the other. In fact, I have been in 42 out of the 50
states, small towns and big cities (and yes, I've been to L.A. and
also D.C. -- I was stationed in CA for two years, and also WA).
It's not bad here at all...I like it well enough to have lived here
for the past 15 years.

Well, that's my 2 cents worth.

Posted by: Khashyar

Thanks for your thoughts and advice, Jerry, Colochef, Jeff and Bob.

I think that Lena would enjoy Florida, but it is pretty unfamiliar to me and my family would be far away.

I love Colorado (I used to live there in the mountains), and I know that real estate is pretty cheap and affordable there compared to the Coasts.

Lena felt that if we did move, then she wanted to live near my family.

I personally wanted to move back to the Rocky Mountains, or perhaps Oregon (where I've always wanted to move).

Lena and I can still have the chance to move later, but I needed to consider what Lena wanted of course.

Khashyar