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Microchip implants - has anyone heard of these ?
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Posted by: rattlesnake6979

I have recently read that in Europe , Govts are considering issuing biometric cards to all citizens but that later there is a possibility that chip implants will be the next step allowing individuls to do busines without needing proof of id and without needing a credit card.

Is this true ? I find this idea scary because I do not want to be chipped and I certianly do not know the full implications of having or not having a chip implant.

Maybe I am overreacting and this is just an irrelevant post that has no significance to noone but any views would be appreciated on this subject.

Rattle

Posted by: wavetossed

I already have a chip implant that allows me to do business with strangers. The chip is in my Barclaycard. I go into a shop, pick an item, the clerk sticks my chip into a terminal and hands it to me, I cover the keypad so nobody can see it and key in 4 secret digits, then remove my card. Chip and PIN!

Some people have the idea that we'll add RFID to this chip, stick it under our skin, and then just walk into a shop with no clerks, grab what we want, and walk straigh out. However, this means that every item must have it's own chip and it means that people will have to carry handguns or switchblades at all times to protect themselves from thieves. When the shops all trust a chip imbedded in your skin, then thieves will simply cut the chip out of your skin whenever they want to shop. And there will be no clerks in the shops to notice that something unusual is going on.

I'll stick with the chip in a plastic card that I can at least cancel and replace whenever it is lost or stolen.

By the way, the US military has been doing stuff with chips embedded in people's bodies since the mid sixties. It is old and tested technology which is currently used commercially in RFID and in tracking animals. I think they gave up on the use for tracking people because they found other things to be more effective like CCTV and spy satellites and GPS trackers hidden in vehincles, etc.

Posted by: Jim_FL

My cat has a chip implanted between her shoulderblades. She had it already when I got her, but not sure I'd have done it otherwise.

Posted by: lester

Microchips are very often implanted in birds of prey too.
Most birds are very valuable and this is seen as an anti-theft
precaution.
Some of the birds in my care have micros implanted, and they
suffer no ill effects.
As Wave says, this has yet to be trialled on humans, but you bet that "big brother" has tested them!

Posted by: rattlesnake6979

I read that a company in Florida have made a chip which is around 10 mm in lenghth which can be implanted in the arm or hand - a trial of the chip was carried out in Barcelona and it was trialed on humans .

What scares me is that no one has explained why a chip is either necessary or why it is needed for all citizens - maybe its paranoia but I why has there been little or no publicity regarding this issue ? As a conspiracy theory I wouldnt put it past the US govt or UK givt to use a micro chip system as both a means to track all citizens as well to pass information ( without thier consent ) to other organisations .

If it has been around for so long , why is there sudenly a need for biometric cards for all EU citizens ?

Rattle

Posted by: Khashyar

Yes, I've also heard of pet birds being able to receive implanted chips in case they are stolen.

I vaguely recall that you can track a chip from a satellite. Does anyone know whether this is true??

Khashyar

Posted by: lester

Hello Khashyar,
The type of chip implanted in my birds cannot be tracked by satellite, they are only readable from a hand held scanner,at approx 1 metre.

For satellite tracking,there are chips fitted to motor vehicles of all types, a common system is "datatag", these systems need a good power supply,
and a bird is too small for this to be carried.

Transponders can be fitted, which have a range of approx 25 kilometres, but the batteries only last for a few hours.
Hope this is useful to you.
lester.

Posted by: Khashyar

Thank you for the information, Lester.

I imagine that in the next few decades, microchip technology will advance considerably.

Khashyar

Posted by: Pawel_PL.USA

Well, if you are familiar with the so-called Parkinson Theory (if unstopped, gvt will continue growing and invading more and more of your private life), then you'd know why I'm quite serious when I say that I fear that sooner or later gvt's will start "branding" their "slaves" in such a way.

Posted by: rattlesnake6979

The trial of the chip implant took place in Barcelona at , believe it or not , a night club - the idea was to trial a credit card free way of paying for drinks, and partying without needing to worry about money or losing a credit card.( The bill would still need to be paid )
I think the idea is gaining ground in small incremental stages that the days of the credit card are nearing thier end and soon clubs, banks , and other institiutions will offer chip implants to thier customers .

Of the people who trialed the chip most were happy with it and some even reported feeling euphoric.
But my argument is the small incremenatl way this technology is being gradually forced on all of western europe and the impact it will have on business - because should a business man / business woman refuse to have a chip implanted this willl certainly lead to problems doing business.

The other planned use is chip implant in the head to control computers and to change mood- I think already the technolgy has advanced enoughth that both hand / arm chip implantation seem on the horizen as well as chip implants in the head.

I think , though this is a nightmarish world - half human - half cyborg - and if followed through will lead to a catstrophe in terms of the freedoms we enjoy today as well as the freedom to travel and to do business - Big Brother will certainly be watching !!!!

Posted by: ConnerVT

Resistance is futile.
You will be assimilated.

Posted by: Khashyar

Posted by: Pawel_PL.USA

The euro-kolkhoz (the EU, for the uninitiated) is already tagging every farm animal within its confines and the way things are going, micro-chip implants in people will probably become fact soon.

Posted by: rattlesnake6979

If this is allowed to continue I am sure before long most citizens of europe will be unwittingly subject to restrictions of movement , association and business that 2 centuries ago woul d have been thought of as unheard of .

The danger is..... no one is really interested in politics- no one sees the point ( In UK less than 50% of population vote in a general election ) - so I guess the apathy of an entire continent will eventually lead to the microchip becomming part and parcel of all our lives.

I really see the chip as a downward development - it reminds me of big brother/ surveillance/ mind contro- all science fiction types of issues but now becoming increasingly a reality in western europe.

rattle

Posted by: wavetossed

Come on rattle. Remember Maggie Thatcher and the poll tax riots? Those people just had to pay a few quid to the taxman. Imaging how big the riots would be if they want to give you a jab big enough to implant a circuit.

It'll never happen.

Posted by: rattlesnake6979

I would say that it is going to happen because banks, and bsuiness will see a chip as a better way to do business ... in effect people will be " forced " to accept the chip if they wish to continue to have a business - this may seem far fetched and heck this is merry old england but IMHO the apathy , and general lack of awareness of this issue has been amazing.

Maggie Thatacher was disliked by many people ... the poll tax was the icing on the cake and the last straw. But this issue is less connected with a forced legal requirement- it is more a development which will force people to accept this in thoer lives because without it business is impossible - eg if I have no car I may lose my job etc.

Its only my opinion ..

Rattle

Posted by: rattlesnake6979

An article from the BBC which was online today 17/10/04.........
What do you guys think ?

Rattle

Security under the skin

By Sean Coughlan
BBC News Online Magazine

A US company has been given the green light to implant microchips in humans. It's intended to provide medical information ... but will it turn into a surveillance system?

How would you like to have the equivalent of a barcode built into your arm?

It would be convenient. A quick scan could save the need to show passports or ID cards. It would be handier than carrying cash or producing medical records.

And a particularly clever barcode would let people find you if you were lost or abducted.

Would it mean less hassle and more security? Or would it make you feel like a DVD tagged in the supermarket? Or like a criminal being monitored everywhere you went?

These are the questions being raised by the emergence of microchips that can be implanted in people's arms - with the technology moving from geeky future-gazing to a mainstream proposition.

VOTE RESULTS
Would you want a chip in your arm?
Yes
21.32%
For medical records only
14.86%

No way
63.83%
17150 Votes Cast
Results are indicative and may not reflect public opinion
This week, the United States Food and Drug Administration gave its approval for an implantable chip which can be used for medical purposes.

A microchip the size of a grain of rice can be inserted below the skin - and will carry an individual's medical records which can be read by a scanner.

The makers of the VeriChip say it will carry information that can save a patient's life during an emergency - such as details of medication, blood groups and allergies or if they have conditions such as diabetes.

In the UK, the British Medical Association says that it would see no ethical reason for not allowing such an implanted device, as long as it was proven to be safe and there was no coercion.

Security device

But there are other applications which are likely to be more contentious.

The implanted chip is about the size of a grain of rice

In a question and answer session, following the announcement of the FDA's approval, the Florida-based company behind the chip, Applied Digital, pointed to other commercial uses.

Security, which remains high on the US domestic agenda, is likely to be a key area for such microchips - offering the chance both to identify and track anyone carrying this type of implant.

Military bases, federal offices, prisons or nuclear plants were mentioned as places where the technology could be applied.

These internal microchips would be checked to regulate entry to secure locations. And once inside, scanners placed around the site would precisely locate the movements of each individual.

There would be no passes, ID cards or dog-tags, because all the information would be held on the chip lodged invisibly below the skin.

If this sounds far-fetched, access to a high-security crime database in Mexico is already being limited to the staff who have had a chip implanted.

While there might still be consumer resistance to getting part of a computer stuck in your arm - the underlying technology is already moving from the laboratory into the High Street.

Pet theory

"Radio frequency identification" chips have been attached to products in the supermarket to monitor shopping patterns.

Implanted chips could control entry to secure buildings

And in response to fears about child abductions, several schools in Japan have experimented with tracking chips being put into pupils' clothing.

Even if we don't want to put microchips into ourselves, we're not squeamish about animals. Following the same basic principle, chips have been injected into millions of pets and farm animals.

But there have been concerns about how such technology could be abused and become a form of undisclosed surveillance, with movements and activities electronically monitored.

Last week, the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) urged lawmakers in Virginia not to put such trackable chips into drivers' licences - arguing that it would breach people's privacy.

Such devices would allow the authorities "to sweep up the identities of everyone at a political meeting or protest march," says the ACLU.

In considering the potential threat to civil liberties, the UK's data watchdog, the Information Commissioner, says it is important to look at the underlying principles, rather than only the technology.

Threats to privacy

And a spokesperson says that much of the capacity to track people already exists - the question is how this information is used.

This "chipped" cat was registered in the US, but found in Oxfordshire

If anyone wanted to introduce such a system into the UK, there would need to be assurances that the information was not being used for any purpose other than clearly declared.

The Information Commissioner's office pointed to the current example of delivery drivers who are tracked using their mobile phones. This is deemed acceptable, as long it is being used for very specific business purposes.

But civil liberties campaigners, Liberty, warn that the arrival of such tracking chips needs to be matched by a tougher legal framework to protect people's privacy.

Spokesperson Barry Hugill says the law is lagging behind this accelerating technology - and that more questions need to be asked about how the information gathered will be used and protected.

"When the technology is so powerful it seems wrong that it should be left to multi-nationals to decide how it should be controlled."

Even though tracking chips are intended for legitimate commercial purposes, there are concerns about how this detailed information about people's movements could be collated and who might have access.

In the wrong hands it would be the "stalkers' dream", he says.