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just some thoughts about RWs in general
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Posted by: Alexey098

Hi everyone, I am new to this forum and I am excited the way you talk about RWs and relations with them. Well, I was born in Russia, I’ve been living here 4 the whole my 18years life. I think that you, American guys just feel euphoria towards generalizing rws. Well 4 sure all ppl are different in every country, and have a lot in common in the world. Let me point some aspects I’d like you to pay attention, it seem like some ppl here are looking not for a partner, but for a toy. Firstly, don’t you think that it’s ridiculous to find the perfect match for you through the agency services? Marriage is a very serious thing, do you go to the gas station to buy you serious medicine? Russian marriage agencies try to sell their stuff (RWs) with better prices, they try to make it seem better, will you eat pepper just because it packed the same way as jellybeans? Then, a woman, who puts her ad in the agency catalog, simply can’t find someone herself, I mean if she’s looking for a AM why just not to go to an internet chat? At least being in a chat you’ll get to know the person better. Going to an agency means that RW is looking not for a partner but a kind of a sponsor, she marries you not a person, but your citizenship and credit card. And doing it by passive way, you find her, not she finds you! Some words about AW also. I know just few AW ( I mean states) also I know some from Canada. Well, and you know, I prefer them better than general RWs. For sure they came in Russia for some reason, they are smart, ambitious etc. there’re also such girls in Russia, but SUCH girls would NEVER put their ads in a catalog of any agency. Because it means failure, only losers do that in my humble opinion. Your plastic smile on the ad picture is a sign of you personal failure. What else… if you want to try your sweetheart just offer her to settle in Russia, men!, it’s reasonable and could be even better. For example a man with “western attitude” can make about $3000 monthly (ab $40k year) here – 13% taxes. Who knows Russian prices would agree that’s better than $90k in US. Russian lifestyle… you know I like American better, but in Russia you gonna live in a big city in 2-3 floors apartment + theatres and stuff… social transportation is the same in UK, don’t worry. Well, seems I am changing the topic. What I don’t like in general RW. When I ask them about their plans on the future, they are being confused for 1 minute then tell they dunno. F.e. my university. AWs are healthier than RWs. AWs are more ambitious and we are like partners sharing the same life attitude, same ambitious career plans, though the harmony of love is kept as a dearest souvenir. RWs better educated? It’s just a myth. What are you going to talk about with them? Russian literature? Russian culture is not open, I mean it’s not “international” like European or American, it’s not integrated. RWs who are interested in international culture, believe me, don’t need you, a, I am very sorry to call you like this, a loser who looks for a sexy toy in Russian marriage agency store. I think you gonna think about it. Don’t ruin your personal life because of no reason, marriage is a serious thing. And by the way French accent is much sweeter than ugly naughty Russian…

Posted by: Pin Boy

Boy have you opened a can of worms!!!! Not sure if you have done it on purpose or not, but you fired the first shot across the bow and should be prepared for the (mostly polite and intelligently written) onslaught you're going to receive.

Posted by: searcher

Alright,

There are some things which I can agree with but much I cannot!

I didn't purposely go looking for RW, it was just coincidental...

So, explain what is the difference in RW who are on a web site versus AW who are on a web site?

I don't like to make generalizations about AW because there are millions and I don't know them all. There are some things which may seem common place regarding attitudes and way of thinking but I think that this is because our society (American Society) has been changing for the worse. Its not just women who have problems but men as well, as you pointed out *some* men are looking for trophies!

I think many people in the U.S. don't know what a true, honesnt, loving relationship is anymore.

I don't see why it is a problem to broaden ones prospects, to look abroad. Why not????

Just like many men generalize about AW you are also making generalizations about RW. There is a certain amount of truth to many things and of course the agencies are going to embellish the supposed good qualities of RW. Because, as you know and have stated, this is what sells - this is what men, in general, are looking for.

But, again, there is a *certain* amount of truth to some of what is stated.

And, of course, these women do need you to pay these expenses. This has never been a secret but to infer that foreign citizenship is the sole reason that the majority of RW seek a foreign husband is making a gross generalization.

Conside this, many RW have been contacted by a lot of men. Some never receive even one letter but a good percentage receive hundreds or thousands of contacts. They don't (and shouldn't) settle for just anyone.

I'll give you an example. The lady I am in correspndance with has received about 4000 letters. She is on the sites of multiple agencies because she could afford the photos. She wasn't in need of money at all. She was very selective.

BUT, she was unhappy with the men she has met at home. You could assume or make generalizations that she is a looser but maybe she just has different criteria than what other women in her city may have.

Posted by: searcher

Here is something else to consider....

If a woman simply wanted to immigrate to another country all she would need is a man who is financially capable.

Age and personality would not matter.

Yet, when you talk to many of these women. They have certain qualities they are looking for in men.

It wouldn't matter if the man were 20, 30 or even 40 years older and they could just latch onto the first "sucker" who shows interest.

To suggest that these women are simply accepting the men they've chosen is equating them with prostitutes.

Why? Because it would suggest that she doesn't care who she has intimate relations with and in a marriage this is part of it.

It would also imply these women have little or no morals.

It would be a generalization and a very bad one!

As my lady told me when I asked her many, many questions about seeking a foreign husband she said she couldn't just sleep with anyone and she couldn't see herself just sleeping with "an old body" as she stated it. She said she had to have a real interest in a person as it is suppose to be a lifetime commitment.

As for me, sure I could probably have chosen a pretty young 18, 19, 20, 21 y.o., etc.... girl but I wanted someone who would have more in common so after I became interested I looked for women close to my age to write to.

I feel that I have made a good choice. My "instincts" or "feelings" tell me that it is right and it when I don't listen to those feelings that I have trouble. So, I have all intention (and I will) follow through with this

Posted by: Alexey098

Dear Searcher, please don’t take everything personal. My logic is going this way (please don’t take everything personal!!!): Russian girl, who’s open minded and rich and thinking different criteria than people in Russia in general (Russian criteria is very stupid believe me, I don’t want to generalize but I dare to say I know every layer of Russian society), so this girl, if she wants to find her husband abroad, may just go there and find, if she has good Engrrrish skills, she may work in international business and stuff, she’s spinning in cycles of intelligent and rich people and foreign people also. I believe in e-love and long distance relationship, I have no prejudices, but… it’s a bit…well, it says no good, if you are going to find someone by the picture, not by the way of thinking. Have you tried to find an AW in the chat of at least your State? I guess there’re many around you were looking for… yes, you’re right, there’s a problem with American Guys, it’s Women who don’t like you, not you liking them. Just because people became less ambitious, I don’t want to generalize. Okay, nothing personal. No generalizing. But for the general expectations of this forum’s members who discuss Russian girls… I can suppose they are looking for a toy from 3d world country. I can assure you, there’re many guys in Russia who match personal criteria of the women’s ads. What do RW want more: excitement, traveling, special romance. You give them these 3 things. + Russian women feel more self confident with a foreigner, because they are afraid successful guys here would treat them snobbish, guys know what they really are… just miserable… well, about American women, for sure they also feel this special romance dating foreigners, successful foreigners by the way, who are able to attract them. I suppose and I feel that this romance comes from diversity. Diversity disappears while you are being engaged… yes, then you know it’s the one you were looking for. I am not judging happiness, only first step. Such first step may be done only by losers.

Posted by: searcher

No, I don't take it personally at all.

I just thought maybe you were making general statements.

I agree with you about somethings, the problem is with people themselves. More specifically, what are they looking for?

For some men, it may be a true love for others its a trophy.

This also applies to women, what are they looking for....?

Its very individual and there are those who put too much into superficial things - looks, money, etc.

Sure, these things are nice but not the only things and they shouldn't be the primary focus.

Posted by: LeoN

Hi all, dear Alexey,
It is always useful to hear a different voice, but i m sure that Alexey, at the age of 18, probably not having known any western woman or girl, couldnt possibly have a broaden view of the case.
Yes, a million of problems will appear in front of us, when we deside to mary a RW.This is a fact, and ppl that are already married to a RW could confirm it right away.In Alexey's point of you it is not normal searching for a bride in the internet.It would be better to find her in real life.What we are missing here is that internet became real life, a 3hours flight Athens-Moscow is real life, multilingual ppl are real life, open minders are real life, etc etc.
There is also an other importand fact that needs to be considered.Those girls (Russian) might be a better choice for a lot of western men.We are dealing in our everyday life with western women.We ve seen all the +s amd the -s, and it seems that there are a lot of -s.That is why we are heading east.Of course there is a risk, but risk is an importand factor of our life.
I have seen a lot of GreekRussian couples, most of these couples look happy.Also, i have seen thousands of Greek couples, in most of them, something is missing.I believe that it is the same in several western countries.

PS.Alexey, do not underestimate RW.

Posted by: Alexey098

Dear LeoN!
I can assure you that I had known American girls. As your location is Generally in Greece I suggest you live around the world. Well, all you tell is real, world is tiny so people are the same everywhere, differs only appearance of their reactions. I don’t deny e-love, I believe in love by internet even more than in real. Loving long distance you value personality more than superficial things. The matter is how do you search your sweetheart: over the match.com by a picture or by less superficial methodology. Looking for a girl in the catalog of marriage agency is the same that buying a car over the magazine. Bad comparison, I know.
Would you be so kind to tell me +s and –s of American fairies then? Even having to generalize please do it, okay.
Oh about multilingual people, just one point, LeoN, have you been to Russia? I think it’s not a secret for everyone that Russian people are just super multilingual! Well, in Europe most students of my age I had talked to, speak at least 4 languages. Go France to find you match!

p.s. don’t overestimate RW.

Posted by: LeoN

Hi Alexey,
Thanx for sharing your thoughts with us.
I ve lived abroad for 2 years in 2 different countries.Furthermore i m travelling outside Greece very often.Due to my work, i have to change locations every 2-3 years, that is why i m declaring ''generally in Greece''.But this is not a forum for my background.
Each and every one of us have a different style in searching (and aproaching) RW.I m sure that there are some men among us that see no diference between ordering pizza and a RW.But these men are not many, thank God.The big majority of western men starts this procedure by browsing profiles in the internet.I know it is not romantic.After exchanging some mails for a period, they visit their potential woman.This is very romantic and very realistic.The more you stay with her, the better conclusions you have.It would be better to stay in Russia for many months, so every aspect of her life could be revealed, but unfortunately most of us can't do that.This is risky.Some men are having 2-3-4 trips before proposing.
I m not gonna mention the +s and -s of western girs.As you said, you had known American girls.
Personaly speaking, i m looking for an english speaking russian girl.I dont wanna mess with interpreters, english or greek lessons etc etc.Well, believe me, those girls do exsist.You can check it out by your self in mIRC (select Rusnet as IRC Network).Don't forget that your homepage is in english.
I ve never been to Russia or Ukraine, i m in the phase of making my homework right now, but i m preparing a trip within the year.
I like most French things, i speak French also, but dont like French girls.I can find this style of women here too.
I would be happy to receive your feedback.It is rare to have a RMs opinion.

Posted by: Alexey098

yeah, using interpreter while making love is a gr8 thing. i will send something later, just buzy with my Western Girl

but i'd like to know general opinion about them, any1 are going to tell me why you dont like them ?

Posted by: Alexey098

Well, +s of RW had been said enough; let me point some –s:
1. stock quotes don’t make sense for them
2. they never care of the baseball game
3. they don’t want to wear American clothes
4. they are slim enough to be seen gardening trees
5. you spend more on their posh make up than their food
6. they aren’t good workers
7. their Russian education was free that means bad
8. they were members of the communists party if they are 31+
9. they wouldn’t value American culture the way American woman will
10. they rarely smile for the first time
11. they find American humor stupid, you 2
12. they seem like a helicopter in a cap, but I must admit sexy in a cowboy hat
13. they will never lose their accents
14. they born Russian children (ask you dad if he’s ready for that)
15. you won’t like the phone bills coming each month
16. they are crazy drivers

but some are good persons

. Best luck guys!

Posted by: Pin Boy

what a trip you are! the only part i agree with completely is the part about not caring about the baseball score

that would also be true of most AW...but if you find a woman who does care - no matter what the nationality - hang on to her because she would be extremely rare

Posted by: klawsite

I'm not wasting my time on this thread!!

Klaw

Posted by: searcher

Quote:

Originally posted by Alexey098
Well, +s of RW had been said enough; let me point some –s:
1. stock quotes don’t make sense for them
They don't make sense to most people

2. they never care of the baseball game
I don't really watch much sports unless cars are involved but then she likes motorsports too!!!!

3. they don’t want to wear American clothes
....and ????

4. they are slim enough to be seen gardening trees
You've been dating the wrong ones

5. you spend more on their posh make up than their food
I spend more on my hobbies than I do on food, so!

6. they aren’t good workers
Lets see, a lot of them go to work, come home take care of (a) child(ren), do the housework, help with homework, etc... Thats not hard working? Housework is work too, right?

7. their Russian education was free that means bad
Gee, I wonder how the Russians managed to achieve all of those things like being the first in space with their bad free educational system. I wish I had more of that bad education. I had to pay off $14,000 in students loans

8. they were members of the communists party if they are 31+
That is understood, if I remember correctly if you wanted to get into the best schools, etc you had to hide you own beliefs and become a member or you were denied access to better education, jobs, etc... Moot point!!

9. they wouldn’t value American culture the way American woman will
Like what exactly?????

10. they rarely smile for the first time
Ask Andrei about mine

11. they find American humor stupid, you 2
Alot of American humor is stupid, so is alot of American T.V. in general. No, she doesn't think i'm stupid

12. they seem like a helicopter in a cap, but I must admit sexy in a cowboy hat
Huh? Only if they are stick thin. I don't care much for cowboy hats unless I got involved in SASS Cowboy Action Shooting
13. they will never lose their accents
It doesn't matter, some men find that sexy anyway so you are only reinforcing their perceptions

14. they born Russian children (ask you dad if he’s ready for that)
I really don't understand this one.

15. you won’t like the phone bills coming each month
Phone cards!!!!!!!!!!!!!

16. they are crazy drivers
So am I ;-)

but some are good persons

. Best luck guys!

Posted by: spamer

Quote:

Originally posted by klawsite
I'm not wasting my time on this thread!!

Oh good!! I'm not a lone on this out look.

Posted by: Bordric

Quote:

Originally posted by Alexey098
Hi everyone, I am new to this forum and I am excited the way you talk about RWs and relations with them. Well, I was born in Russia, I’ve been living here 4 the whole my 18years life. I think that you, American guys just feel euphoria towards generalizing rws. Well 4 sure all ppl are different in every country, and have a lot in common in the world. Let me point some aspects I’d like you to pay attention, it seem like some ppl here are looking not for a partner, but for a toy. Firstly, don’t you think that it’s ridiculous to find the perfect match for you through the agency services? Marriage is a very serious thing, do you go to the gas station to buy you serious medicine? Russian marriage agencies try to sell their stuff (RWs) with better prices, they try to make it seem better, will you eat pepper just because it packed the same way as jellybeans? Then, a woman, who puts her ad in the agency catalog, simply can’t find someone herself, I mean if she’s looking for a AM why just not to go to an internet chat? At least being in a chat you’ll get to know the person better. Going to an agency means that RW is looking not for a partner but a kind of a sponsor, she marries you not a person, but your citizenship and credit card. And doing it by passive way, you find her, not she finds you! Some words about AW also. I know just few AW ( I mean states) also I know some from Canada. Well, and you know, I prefer them better than general RWs. For sure they came in Russia for some reason, they are smart, ambitious etc. there’re also such girls in Russia, but SUCH girls would NEVER put their ads in a catalog of any agency. Because it means failure, only losers do that in my humble opinion. Your plastic smile on the ad picture is a sign of you personal failure. What else… if you want to try your sweetheart just offer her to settle in Russia, men!, it’s reasonable and could be even better. For example a man with “western attitude” can make about $3000 monthly (ab $40k year) here – 13% taxes. Who knows Russian prices would agree that’s better than $90k in US. Russian lifestyle… you know I like American better, but in Russia you gonna live in a big city in 2-3 floors apartment + theatres and stuff… social transportation is the same in UK, don’t worry. Well, seems I am changing the topic. What I don’t like in general RW. When I ask them about their plans on the future, they are being confused for 1 minute then tell they dunno. F.e. my university. AWs are healthier than RWs. AWs are more ambitious and we are like partners sharing the same life attitude, same ambitious career plans, though the harmony of love is kept as a dearest souvenir. RWs better educated? It’s just a myth. What are you going to talk about with them? Russian literature? Russian culture is not open, I mean it’s not “international” like European or American, it’s not integrated. RWs who are interested in international culture, believe me, don’t need you, a, I am very sorry to call you like this, a loser who looks for a sexy toy in Russian marriage agency store. I think you gonna think about it. Don’t ruin your personal life because of no reason, marriage is a serious thing. And by the way French accent is much sweeter than ugly naughty Russian…

Hello Alexey,

Thanks for your candor, I think it was needed. I am not looking for a toy myself but I have given up on the fast life American women, at least the ones that I have met seem to enjoy. Maybe I am just wishing for something that is not there but it is sad what women here are looking for. They are taught all their lives to want the best man, the best car, the best house, the best children to where it has caused me to look elsewhere. They are so wrapped up in what everyone else thinks that they forget to live! I really just want to get back to the basics, I have not used any agency and I am currently talking to someone who is very interesting to me. We only use our own email address. Of course she is looking for something and I am too. She wants to better her life and be with someone who respects her for what she is and to be able to have a stable family for raising children etc.

I am not unattractive and have several dates, and could have more if I wanted. However there is something exotic about something new and different. I am not looking for Russian women because I am unable of finding homegrown ladies. I am looking because I want something real and special. Just look at some of these guys photos, do you really think they could not get a date here in the US or UK or anywhere else for that matter. For the vast majority of us it is not a toy but a lifelong desire to find the right person. Actually the girl I am talking to does not even live in Russia. But I have tried the internet agencies and found them lacking. I think it is too easy to find someone with similar interest without paying for it. www.Match-seeker.com comes to mind actually.

Anyway do not judge everyone as some desperate lonely person, I turned down a date just this evening so I could call the person I am really attracted too. Is she real? Is she faking just to get me to help her out of her country? I do not know, but damned if I will pass up the chance because I am afraid of such things. I think she is real and sincere in her feelings, I will know for sure when I visit.

But please I ask you to not hold it against men from other nations seeking women all over. It is not an insult to you or your country, it is actually a compliment. There are between 4000 to 6000 forieng marriages in the USA out of 2.5 million or so that are domestic. We are not here to insult your women or make them out to be desperate. It is much more complicated then that, I am looking for someone my age and who enjoys things I do. Without all the strings attached. Damn if you only understood how hard it is to be yourself in some of these countries we come from you would understand more.

This is my take on the whole thing. I do not care if the lady is black, white, yellow, purple, PHD or high school. I am looking for much more then that. No doubt there are men that are only seeking toys, and damn them for it. But do not judge all by that stick, for it is not true.

Posted by: Ray50

I'm not taking the time to read every word in this thread. There is only one thing I can say. If I can find women more beautiful and passionate than FSU women then I will maybe become interested in them. As far as I am concerned the women of Russia, Ukraine, Latvia and Romania are the most beautiful on the planet.

Posted by: Bordric

Quote:

Originally posted by Ray50
I'm not taking the time to read every word in this thread. There is only one thing I can say. If I can find women more beautiful and passionate than FSU women then I will maybe become interested in them. As far as I am concerned the women of Russia, Ukraine, Latvia and Romania are the most beautiful on the planet.

They do seem to have eyes that make you melt.

Seriously I have never seen eyes like some of these ladies have, they can look into the very soul and melt a mans heart in a matter of moments.

Posted by: klawsite

Hi everyone,

I want to chime in on what Ray said...

Quote:

If I can find women more beautiful and passionate than FSU women then I will maybe become interested in them. As far as I am concerned the women of Russia, Ukraine, Latvia and Romania are the most beautiful on the planet.

When I decided to find the love of my life. I decided, why not look all over the world. I did not lock in on just women from the FSU.
But after meeting Nadya, I agree with Ray 100%. I am not looking for a toy. I was looking for my soul mate. She just happens to live in Belarus!!

-Kevin

Posted by: andrei

Quote:

Originally posted by Alexey098
Well, +s of RW had been said enough; let me point some –s:
1. stock quotes don’t make sense for them
2. they never care of the baseball game
3. they don’t want to wear American clothes
4. they are slim enough to be seen gardening trees
5. you spend more on their posh make up than their food
6. they aren’t good workers
7. their Russian education was free that means bad
8. they were members of the communists party if they are 31+
9. they wouldn’t value American culture the way American woman will
10. they rarely smile for the first time
11. they find American humor stupid, you 2
12. they seem like a helicopter in a cap, but I must admit sexy in a cowboy hat
13. they will never lose their accents
14. they born Russian children (ask you dad if he’s ready for that)
15. you won’t like the phone bills coming each month
16. they are crazy drivers

but some are good persons . Best luck guys!

So the dude is trying to say that our women suck. I wonder who he sleeps with then as long as he lives in St. Pete. With an American student who loves the dumbest game in the world (baseball), cares for the most elementary culture in the world (American) and spends her dough on hamburgers instead of makeup. Dude, being a Russian yourself, you're on the wrong way. Maybe I'm too patriotic right now with these statements, but being unpatriotic like you is like disrespecting your Mother. Russian girls that surround you don't even have a scarce idea of what a stinker you are in fact. Let me put this in Russian now,

ty gonish, mudilo, eto ne tot forum shtoby naezjat na russkih jenshin. prikinsa valenkom ili pizduy podalshe)))

P.S. "they born russian children" i guess he was trying to say "her child will be a Russian one, how do you like that?" like having a Russian child is a dishonor. Our children are beautiful and smart. If you think the opposite way then recall that you too were that little Russian Down-syndrome idiot you're talking about when you were a kid.

Posted by: Alexey098

Alright guys! I cannot agree with some points, and I think you still feel euphoria towards generalizing rws. If you met a Russian girl and she’s a special and perfect, it absolutely doesn’t mean that all RW are special and perfect, it also doesn’t mean that among gils from FSU is the biggest percentage of special and perfect girls. If you met a RW and love her and sure in her feelings – you’re the luckiest man in the world. I know what means to love and be loved in return, whatever Russian, American or Chinese your soul mate is. I absolutely agree with Bordic whatever girl is, if she’s special don’t lose your chance, it may be only once ever. But don’t generalize that all RWs are good. Russia is big. The United States is big. So people are different in American States, and in Russian federation’s objects (or subjects) don’t know how is it called, ask Andrei, he knows. Okay, we can’t deny that some nations have general features (look, Andrei is a precise example of Russian guy) if you need Russian features, come on go and get it. I guess everyone is searching for something missing. For you Russian features are missing, for me Americans (and by the way I just got to know this forum is about American-Russian dating some minutes ago, I found the forum pages by searching in google.com for “American community and expatriates in Saint-Petersburg Russia”). Whatever, be yourself, nationality doesn’t matter at all. Really matters personality. (I will never agree that Russian girls, children etc. are better than somewhere in the world) I wish you to be completely happy! Best luck.

Dear Andrei! Guess why am I not so patriotic? I like Russia, Russian nature, culture, open-minded people, amazing land… only people as you spoil all… Russia spoiled by its silly population. Next time watch your language okay? Some people can read Russian… no wonder, why Russian women prefer Americans instead of you. And I guess American student in Russia must be smarter than Russian who never traveled out of Omsk.

p.s. some people didn’t get an idea about Russian children, well it was a little typo (not you dad, but your dad, you should read like this - ask your dad if he’s ready)

Posted by: LeoN

Things are getting tough, and i thing some of us should calm down.
No one will force us to marry a RW.We are taking our chances with them.If we meet a girl that we dont like, we will not marry her.No one said that RW are angels.This is not a perfect world and surely Russia is not a perect place in several ways.There are good women in Russia, USA, France, Uganda, even Turkey.What we are saying here is, that RW are gathering some characteristics that makes them better, ACCORDING TO OUR INDIVIDUAL CRITERIONS, than western girls.Apparently Alexey's criterions are standing at the oposite pole.

Posted by: Ray50

You can find good and bad in everything.
RW may not be perfect, God knows AW aren't perfect.
We are attracted to RW each for a special reason and mine I told you was their beauty and passion.
I think a large number of AW are superficial, money grabbing, petty and only interested in furthering their careers.
I had a girlfriend once who went ballisitic when she lost a contact lens.
Maybe some RW will change when they move to the US, it is a culture shock,
You can't ask someone to move 5,000 miles and feel at home right away.
Our cultures are quite different.
So my argument (not that I want to argue) is that I just don't have an interest in AW.

Posted by: zdrd

Hey Andrei......what is wrong with baseball? Is it dumb because you don't understand it or because it is an American pastime? I guess your a big Ice hockey/figure skating/gymnastics fan huh?
Now what is this about American culture being elementary? "Elementary" has several different meanings and I will assume that you meant it as "simple"...am I right? So our culture is simple? Not that you meant it in a negative way because you, living in American culture all your life, should understand it right? In my opinion, I think that American culture is very complex. When people from everyone country of the world immigrates to one single country for a better opportunity and have to learn to live with each other side by side and break social and color barriers ( of course there is more work to be done) I think that could qualify as complex. If it wasn't for our elementary culture most of Europe (including the mighty FSU) might all be a part of Germany today. Look at the French, they turned their back on America and GB....how quickly they forget about Normandy. Andrei I am curious to hear your views on the whole Russia/Chehnya/Dagestan conflict......but perhaps that should be saved for another thread. Another thing about American culture....we can be some sarcastic bastards huh?

In Alexey's case I believe that some of his opinions may be true and may not be true. I think it all comes down to percentages, there is good and bad in everything. When I was 18 I would probably have thought that AM seeking RW were guys who were "losers" and could not find attractive AW unless they had fat wallets. As I am a bit older now, I know that is not always the case as most of the guys on this thread have stated. The internet has changed everything...including dating. So I say to each his own!

One last thing, I personally believe that Leon will end up marrying a Turkish girl.

Posted by: andrei

Hi

just to answer your questions

I just thought that the guy from St. Pete was too radical with his statements about Russian women, so I kinda tried to make a counteraction, and as I always do, it turned out to be just another furious offending shout-out ))).

Of course the only reason that we call baseball dumb is because we never care about it. I seen it a couple of times on TV (along with American football) and my reaction was like "what's special about it????". Maybe that's because Im a hockey fan indeed.)))

American culture can be called elementary because it's about 300 years old only if Im not mistaken. For sure, it doesn't seem elementary to you, and it won't seem elementary to anyone who has read Mark Twain's books or seen Tom Hanks acting. But if you watch films we watch on TV and in the movies, if you see the videos we see, the TV programmes that are made in USA, you're gonna say "can't they be like... more intelligent"? I hope you correct me if Im wrong.

Chechen war is a war. Both sides should just stop. But only if they stop simultaneously the war stops. If we send our troops back home - Chechn terrorists will burn us in our own houses. If Chechens give up- the Government will eliminate not only the terrorists but all other Chechens too. I guess only time will tell.

But one thing that I know for sure is that when I see a guy from Caucasus on the street I feel fear and hate at the same time. It's in our blood I guess.

Posted by: Peter Burns

If I meet her my wife in England thats fine - if Australia - thats fine - if USA - ok and if Russia - thats Ok - the point is Im looking for a person not some commodity . Any woman can smell insincerity a mile off and I dont believe in generalisations - generalisations makes all men dwarfs - ie if I believe lies , genralisations and propaganda or go around with the idea that at 40 Im going to marry a 25 year old gymnast then I dont need marriage , I need psychiatric treatment.

Posted by: LeoN

Could we focus strictly in RW?I believe that your opinions about stupid wars like Iraq, chechnya etc etc should be posted somewhere else.

Posted by: golek

Alexey is the classic troll. He's a teenager who thinks he knows everything. He's on the internet one day bored from playing Half Life or Everquest or whatever and he comes across this site that has a bunch of guys on it with Russian girlfriends and wives. What better fun than to write a bunch of insulting crap about them and sit back and read their pissed off responses?

Alexey, get a life! Nobody here cares about your ignorant opinion. Most of us got over that a long time ago. Go back to plane camping on BF42 or whatever you do when you're not in class.

Posted by: Arnold

Hello zdrd,

FYI, Russia was the reason the US joined the war!

The fear was that Europe would be one giant communist state, nothing else mattered to the US.

The fate of Germany was sealed, when it attacked the Soviet Union. The US were not needed. This was a war amongst Europeans, just like the prior war. America's interference in European affairs never has been, and never will be appreciated.

They knew about the Jewish "situation" for seven years before they took action. So don't start talking about that either!

Regarding your lovely diversity in the US, only rich people, or sought after professionals can come here somewhat easily. If you don't have money you do it like the Mexicans and Chinese -- not very healthy though. Or you try to get in as a foreign wife!

Baseball and Football sucks, the players are ahundred years old, and nothing moves.

You cannot call "seggregation" diversity. Everyone here sticks to their own group. Their is no "melting pot". Wake up. It's a myth!

-- Arnold

Posted by: andrei

Quote:

Originally posted by Arnold
Hello zdrd,

FYI, Russia was the reason the US joined the war!

The fear was that Europe would be one giant communist state, nothing else mattered to the US.

The fate of Germany was sealed, when it attacked the Soviet Union. The US were not needed. This was a war amongst Europeans, just like the prior war. America's interference in European affairs never has been, and never will be appreciated.

They knew about the Jewish "situation" for seven years before they took action. So don't start talking about that either!

Regarding your lovely diversity in the US, only rich people, or sought after professionals can come here somewhat easily. If you don't have money you do it like the Mexicans and Chinese -- not very healthy though. Or you try to get in as a foreign wife!

Baseball and Football sucks, the players are ahundred years old, and nothing moves.

You cannot call "seggregation" diversity. Everyone here sticks to their own group. Their is no "melting pot". Wake up. It's a myth!

-- Arnold

WOAH!

Arnold has just said what I was afraid to speak about.
He's even much more radical about this question than me!
I know that USSR had won the war, not the US, but on the other hand I wouldn't speak out about segregation in the US, I don't know jack Sh-T about it. Arnold, you've killed it.

P.S. Our hockey team has won today!!!! hurrahh!!!

Posted by: golek

This history tangent really should be in another forum, but I feel I must weigh in on this world war 2 issue that seems to be so contentious. Overly simplistic perspectives on who won the war are unhelpful toward healing the divide between Russia and America and are inaccurate as well.

One side says, "If it wasn't for us, y'alld be speaking German!!!"

the other says, "Russia really defeated Hitler, the US and the west did little and were unnecessary".

Both ideas are flawed, in my opinion, and are just used to inflame the other side by proclaiming, "We are the greatest, you are nothing".

In reality, neither side could have been guaranteed to defeat the Axis powers alone. Russia did win the war in Europe on the ground and did by far the most fighting and paid the highest cost. The fighting on the Western Front was never close to the scale of what was going on in the east. But what if the US had sat out the war and stayed neutral. Resource starved Japan would have most surely moved into the Russian Far East and then it would have been Russia which was fighting a two front war instead of Germany. The outcome could have been quite different then. There wouldn't have been the relentless night and day bombing of German industrial centers and the war could have lengthened the war by years, maybe long enough for German scientists to deploy their new super weapons like long range bombers, ballistic missiles and atomic bombs to use on the battlefields of Europe. But it didn't happen that way. Instead Japan was busy fighting the western powers in the war in the Pacific and Russia was free to defeat the Germans in Europe.

It was teamwork and politics were put aside for the good of mankind.

Posted by: zdrd

Golek,

I totally agree w/ you. I just wanted to "stir it up" w/ Andrei a bit. Andrei threw the first punch so I had to counter. There is no doubt that the FSR/CIS/RF/Russia has helped shaped the world and has a long and storied history. I think with both of our countries there will always be some blemishes in the history books and not to mention some controversy in world politics (especially with recent developments in Afganistan and Iraq). If we look at the first gulf war (not to get off track...oh well I guess this thread will have to move) I think most will agree it was the right thing to do to have an American lead coailition stop the agressor from occupying Kuwait (regardless if it was mostly to protect our oil interest). Again look at what happened in Bosnia, I think all would agree that NATO lead by the American war machine was "just" in that operation (as ethnic clensing is something that civilized countries should not let take place in todays world). Then of course there is Afganistan, until the US (and others) retaliated, most of the western world really did not know just how badly the good people of Afganistan (especially the women) were surpressed. It is unfortunate and very sad that it took 3000+ American civilian lives to rid Afganistan of the Taliban and certain terrorist cells. No doubt it will be many years before there is significant progress to help her get back on her feet but it is a start. And of course now there is the worldwide debate over Iraq. I think the world is a better place without Saddam and his henchmen. I believe the coalition should have finished him off back in the early 90's (obviously weighs on many people's minds and a mistake in my opinion) but it didn't. Believe me I wish WMD's were found in Iraq but they weren't (yet?) but I am glad Saddam is gone and the rebuilding process will begin over time. Is it worth 500+ American lives (and those of the other nations involved)? I sure do hope that in the end, the world will come together and say it was.....then we can all meet up in France and Germany and celebrate a better time in our history. As for you Andrei, when you come to America, I am taking you to Disney World and to a baseball game at Yankee stadium.....I am gonna feed you hot dogs and Budweiser (I prefer Heneiken myself). After the game we are going to visit the WTC site then we will go pray at St. Patricks Catherdral (If you prefer I also know a beautiful Russian Orthodox church nearby). We will then go out on the town and chase American women all night long.....oh and drink some more beer too:-)

Cheers to all,
~d

Posted by: Arnold

Hello Golek,

How come I am told to post somewhere else, and then you rewrite history by spinning off on WWII, US propaganda themes?

Next thing you tell me, Santa really lives on the North Pole...

I wonder what your Russian girlfriend thinks about that? I know, you are going to say she agrees with you! But perhaps, only, because Russian women are brought up to be agreeable with their "men" in public.

So in other words, you are saying it's OK for you to be a patriot, but not for anyone else? And then you babble something about we all should be friends... But I guess only as long as we don't appear to have a unfavorable opinion!

Russia is a Superpower my friend. It does not need the help of the US. The US knows this, and only little if any help is offered to the Federation.

-- Arnold

Posted by: Arnold

Andrei,

Don't listen to him, obviously he is trying to "bribe" you into submission.

And just offering inexpensive fun to a guest of our country, and generously offering our women, too. Gee, that's so nice, zdrd!

Bring a pillow Andrei, you will need it.

Zdrd,

I think, it is also pretty offensive to offer hospitality to someone who can not come here without having someone to sponsor him,
but then American's are generally oblivious to the fact how hard it is for foreigners to get into their country. Sorry, but it's rude.

-- Arnold

Posted by: golek

Arnold,

I'll leave it to the members to decide whose version of history is more accurate and reasonalble yours or mine. I have no more to say on this subject.

Posted by: zdrd

Arnold,

Where is the love? I don't get to make the travel laws around here.......out of the goodness of my heart I was hoping to perhaps give Andrei a good laugh. Wait a minute, Arnold, you live in America right? Since you know so much about American immigration/travel policy why don't you capaign to change it and stop barking at me for something you assumed was offensive? I think you jumped the gun....my friend. Not to entertain your unecessary post but why do you think it is it so hard for people from the FSR to travel to the states (visitors visa)? They are a few reasons.....but make sure you do your homework so you can state an educated reply.

~d

ps...just for the record in order for a country to be considered a "superpower" it must have:

1) A strong economy
2) An overpowering military
3) Immense international political influence/power
4) A strong national ideology

If Russia was a world superpower you would think the goverment & policy makers (I am not talking about the good Russian people) could manage affairs in their own backyard starting with the Chechnya situation. At the end of the day it's going take NATO or some form of world pressure to get some help to that region. I am not saying Russia is in the wrong (for it's problems w/ Chechnya) but a superpower should be able to handle or at least take the "high road" in actively seeking a civil and peaceful resolution. A concerned superpower should open the dioplomatic doors to a resolution and not just ignore it. Maybe Russia should ask other nations for help but then again that could show weekness......

Posted by: Arnold

I accept the conditions of the armistice.

-- Arnold

Posted by: Arnold

Whatever, my friend!

You have your point of view and I have mine...

-- Arnold

Posted by: Alexey098

Quote:

Originally posted by golek
Alexey is the classic troll. He's a teenager who thinks he knows everything. He's on the internet one day bored from playing Half Life or Everquest or whatever and he comes across this site that has a bunch of guys on it with Russian girlfriends and wives. What better fun than to write a bunch of insulting crap about them and sit back and read their pissed off responses?

Alexey, get a life! Nobody here cares about your ignorant opinion. Most of us got over that a long time ago. Go back to plane camping on BF42 or whatever you do when you're not in class.

Okay, gentlemen, reading your boring postings with stupid discussions about WW2 and the advantages of cultures I wonder do you discuss all these crappish things with your girlfriends or wives? You know, while making love to a girl from another culture, I guess it’s obvious to realize all cultures are equal and political crap isn’t just so important at all, isn’t it? So what’s up? Can you even being in love with a girl from another country forget all your damned national pride and stuff? One question. You guys, say you love your Russian soulmates, right, so who did try to learn Russian from you? Who does know Russian culture very well, to get at least C+ for the Russian-culture in Montana’s college course? Huh? Why can’t you make an effort to understand your Russian girl’s life in Russia?
Dear Golek, you sounded very offensive last time, don’t you think so? I am not going to talk about your politeness, sir, but… well, now I see the reason you married Russian. I wonder what could you do with your computer being 18, well, you may say my webpage looks weird, right I have no time for finally compiling ASP version, with all features to look professional. Whatever, I just keep it for pix. And at least having computer background I don’t use computer related terms in my daily life. Okay man, I never play computer games and stuff, being 18 (I turned 18 recently), I have had job experience working as a system administrator with one dynamic company (studying in the University at the same time btw) and now my candidature is in the processing for the software consultant position with a very huge salary, and I am sure that in accordance to the cost of life here and there, I am more successful than you are (I even don’t have a degree yet) . And I can afford for my girlfriend (even an American one) better life than you. Go east babies! Are you just afraid of challenging AW?

Posted by: Arnold

Hello Alexey!

Look, you are the one who started insulting people on this site, so if you can only dish it out, but you are not man enough to take it, then I am wondering why you are comming back with more rude remarks?

I mean, I can not speak for Golek, but it did look somewhat "odd" when you went ahead and insulted everyone on here.

So what do you want?

-- Arnold

Posted by: golek

Quote:

Originally posted by Alexey098
I wonder do you discuss all these crappish things with your girlfriends or wives?

If by "crappish things" you mean politics, then yes, we do sometimes talk about politics, but only since she arrived in the US. When she was still in Russia, no, she would always refuse saying she was too afraid that somebody was listening and it might cause problems for her.

Posted by: Arnold

Goodmorning Golek,

Really, this is still a problem over there?

I am sorry if I pissed you off earlier, but I really think the US just went in to mop things up.
I am not saying that this was bad, I just offered an alternate point of view.

Is it allowed to ask if she agrees with you on everything regarding politics, or does she offer differing points of view?

If this is to personal, don't feel obligated to answer!

Best wishes, Arnold

Posted by: ConnerVT

I have found Golek to be a fairly wise and reasonable person. Because of the history and content of his past postings, I take the content of what he writes with serious thought.

Alexey can offer the insight of an 18 year old Russian male. He has little history here, and what he has posted is colored by his age and (limited) experiences.

We all can make our own judgment of which we choose to listen.

@ Golek -- You did raise to the bait, after seeing the line in the water...

("Trolling" has nothing rally to do with Trolls that live under bridges, although the visual metaphor may be appropriate at times. It refers to the fishing method, where a person "trolls" or brags their bait back and forth across an area they think fish will raise up and strike their bait.)

Posted by: Arnold

Good mrning to you as well, Conner!

Actually, we call the trolls that live under the bridges bums!

Best wishes, Arnold

Posted by: golek

Thanks for the props, Conner.

Arnold - No I wasn't pissed off, just had nothing more to say about it.

No, we don't agree about politics all the time.

As to fear to speak about politics, I don't know if it's founded or not in today's Russia. I think one could get differing opinions on that, but apparently the fear can linger on even after the threat may subside.

Posted by: ConnerVT

Quote:

Originally posted by golek
Thanks for the props, Conner.

No problem. You've earned your respect here. I don't always agree with you, but then, if I did, it would be a dull place, wouldn't it?

Depending who you ask, it's said you don't discuss politics, money, sex, and religion in polite company (pick any three).

Posted by: ConnerVT

Quote:

Originally posted by Arnold
Actually, we call the trolls that live under the bridges bums!

Here in the Socialist Republic of Vermont, those folks are usually called homeless. Or for the more Politically Correct, they are classified as Domestically Displaced, Economically Challanged Individuals.

Posted by: Arnold

I just wanted to let you know that finally hell is starting to freeze over... which is good, because I can't stand the heat anymore...

Sorry, for talking in riddles!

I am extremely happy now, and I wanted to share this with you guys!

Best wishes, Arnold

Posted by: searcher

Quote:

Originally posted by ConnerVT
Here in the Socialist Republic of Vermont, those folks are usually called homeless. Or for the more Politically Correct, they are classified as Domestically Displaced, Economically Challanged Individuals.

Socialist republic!

Well at least you guys have lots of space, open land, CCW's, No SB-23, etc, etc but that for another thread or another forum altogether!

I'd like that republic...except the cold weather

Posted by: ConnerVT

Quote:

Originally posted by searcher
Well at least you guys have lots of space, open land, CCW's, No SB-23, etc, etc

CCW & SB-23? Yeah, it's hard for the left to put too much restrictions here in New England -- too many hunters and a strong NRA.

As for the cold, it was warmer in Russia! It's been over two weeks since we have seen temps above freezing, and the next few days will be 5 to -15 F!

At least I still have a lot of firewood left (it's a toasty 75 F inside right now

).

There's a lot of open space in CA, too. You just got to move out of the LA basin. But then, you need to work, too.

"Free space" is a different matter. Vermont is also home to many CC&R restricted land (my city has 40% of it's land Type I/A condo or PUD), tight zoning laws, and Act 250, making it also very "Business Hostile".

Vermont has a socialist mayor for it's largest city (changed the party name to "Progressive", but by any other name...), where Bernie Sanders I-VT is our house rep, "Jumpin'" Jim Jeffords I-VT and Pat Leahy D-VT for our senators, and (soon to be former) Democratic Presidential Candidate Howard Dean was our Governor. If any more people stood on the left hand side of the state, it would soon be in California!

Posted by: Arnold

But it is spelled the way it is pronounced:

Kah-leeh-fohr-nee-ahh!

Best wishes, Arnold

Posted by: campanula

Quote:

Originally posted by Arnold

...
And just offering inexpensive fun to a guest of our country, and generously offering our women, too. Gee, that's so nice, zdrd!

.......

Zdrd,

I think, it is also pretty offensive to offer hospitality to someone who can not come here without having someone to sponsor him,
but then American's are generally oblivious to the fact how hard it is for foreigners to get into their country.

-- Arnold

Bravo, Arnold!

Posted by: Jutman

Be proud of that (socialist mayor), It means that there is hope for USA. !!

I can spoke you american, with socialism anytime.

For the netincome over 48000USD I pay 68% in tax. And gross-tax* has already been introduced.

*Before tax dectucable issue (we pay 9%)

Posted by: searcher

Quote:

Originally posted by Jutman
Be proud of that (socialist mayor), It means that there is hope for USA. !!

*YIKES*

Posted by: ConnerVT

Quote:

Originally posted by searcher
*YIKES*

Don't worry, he's not running for re-election, which most of the city's taxpayers are certainly glad.

As for his predecessor, Rep. Bernie Sanders VT-I, even the Democrats in the house don't pay him too much attention.

Posted by: Arnold

Depending who you ask, it's said you don't discuss politics, money, sex, and religion in polite company (pick any three).

[/B][/QUOTE]

Thank you, Conner, for the advise!

Hello Everybody (including Conner)!

I meant to let this one go, but I cannot!

If someone post something I don't like, I will challenge them on it. If they do have better arguments, I might take them into consideration, but I will not be able to change my or another's point of view by keeping quiet.

Also staying silent means that you are in agreement, even if you are not. That is the reason why I will challenge anyone who posts opinions that are offensive from my point of view.

I know, I have posted a few offensive opinions myself, but at least, I can handle criticism and I will admit if I think I am wrong, but people who cannot do this should not post opinions.

Like I said before, if you can not take it, don't dish it out!

Best wishes, Arnold

Posted by: ConnerVT

Quote:

Originally posted by Arnold
Also staying silent means that you are in agreement, even if you are not. That is the reason why I will challenge anyone who posts opinions that are offensive from my point of view.

No, staying silent only means that you have not stated your opinion, either by choice or neglect.

I try to remember it's better to choose your battles, as it's more important to win the important ones, not necessarily all of them.

This thread was started by a young man who seemed to be trolling to start an argument. To me, it is more important not to give him the satisfaction.

Posted by: Arnold

Quote:

Original geschrieben von ConnerVT
No, staying silent only means that you have not stated your opinion, either by choice or neglect.

I try to remember it's better to choose your battles, as it's more important to win the important ones, not necessarily all of them.

This thread was started by a young man who seemed to be trolling to start an argument. To me, it is more important not to give him the satisfaction.

Hello Conner,

My point is, we can have an "argument" at any point of time, we do not need outside help!

I think, it is important to state your opinion, because if it is flawed, maybe you allow for it to be corrected by another point of view.
In addition, what if keeping silent gives the impression that everyone shares this opinion, and this in turn frightens others into submission, or silence?

I am sorry if some people are very sensitive and get there feelings hurt in a public discussion, I do not mean them any harm. I was not going to "battle" over opinions, I simply stated an oposing theory.

Best wishes, Arnold

Posted by: Jutman

Hi

I am not sure, but it seems you don't understand my comment was not serious. That why i made this:

Posted by: Arnold

Hello Brian,

This is not about you, or any of your comments.

I just made a statement to what Conner semi-jokingly said about discussion conduct.

Like I said before I agree to a point with him, for example that controversial issues will elicit a wide spread of opinions.

Thus leading to arguments. But I don't think that we should not talk about whatever we want to bring up. We then have to be tolerant though about answers that might not nessecarily be agreeable to us.

Conner made another good point along these lines, where he said that it is important "to chose ones battles", because apparently many people view an open discussion forum as a "battle ground", and the way I understood his comment, he was posing the rhethorical question, "Why give them what they want?".

My addition to his view point simply is that if I read something from anyone that I don't agree with, I will comment on that. After all, other members have told me as well, when they did not agree with the content of my posts.

My hope in doing this is that either I can learn something new, or maybe someone else might change their point of view on something.

But like I said earlier this was not based on your comment, if I had an issue with it I would have made a post in regard to it.

Best wishes, Arnold

Posted by: Ironheart

HEY SEARCHER...YOU TOOK THE WORDS RIGHT OUT OF MY MOUTH!!! To be honest...I have had many female russian friends for a years now. And it has been the russian males that I could not tolerate. They were the most envious and obnoxious louts I have ever met. It seems to me this 18 year old has his own issues to grow up to and find out eventually what is the real truth with perceptions of east and western people. All the RUSSIAN women I have known said that the russian men lack real committment to what is really important in this life! Honesty, truth, courage, fidelity, integrity to morals and love, the real love not the lust or booze they are mostly driven by. But this is mostly what these Russian women I know told me of THEIR experiences of Russian men. The lady I am interested in that I have known for 3 years now refuses to associate with Russian men anymore. She complains of their complete lack of morals.

Posted by: Ironheart

By the way, I will take a thin tall hard working russian woman anyday to the females that live here in Texas...most of the ones here are very very overweight pimple faced ...and smell bad and extremely malcontentious. This boy is confusing american women's ambition with just plain old greed!!!!