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Our Important Relationship Decisions
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Posted by: TimmyJ

Hello All,

How are you all doing? I hope that things are going well for everyone!

I have some important concerns now and I am interested to hear what all of you think. Please give me your honest opinions Thank you kindly!

I met a wonderful lady which is from the Belarus we have been corresponding for 1 1/2 years and it has been a truly wonderful time. We met twice in person last year 2006. I successfully applied and brought my Fiancee Natalie here and she is currently with me now in the USA. She arrived mid May and our relationship has been truly great. We love each other much. Our communication is wonderful and we have done so much with the time that she is here.

I will skip ahead with all the fine details and get right down to my questions and deep concerns. Natalie only has about 3 weeks left and we have to decide if we want to get married. I am pretty damm sure that I want to marry her but I could sense the uncertaintly that she has within her. When we talk about our future together and getting married she seems to be sure with her decisions one day and the next day she changes her thoughts and is unsure.

Three more weeks is not a heck of a long time and we need to decide pronto. I think that she feels homesick at times and she misses her Mom and her only grown son. She asked me one time what about she would return home and we would re-apply for her K1 all over again! I quess I wouldn't mind cause I Love her but it seems to get harder to wait that amount of time and the CICS rules concerning Visa's seem to get tighter. A lawyer told me that we could fill out and apply for a waiver. I don't know much about this and was kind of vague about this topic, he was in a hurry like all lawyers seem to be.

I would appreciate any comments from the forum community. Good Luck and Happiness to you all.

Regards,
Timmy

Posted by: AkMike

"I am pretty damm sure that I want to marry her "
Are you 110% sure? If there is doubts then wit and see what happens. Maybe she is also "pretty sure" but not totally...
From what you have said you 2 need more time to make the decision.

Posted by: Longfellow

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimmyJ

I am pretty damm sure that I want to marry her but I could sense the uncertaintly that she has within her. When we talk about our future together and getting married she seems to be sure with her decisions one day and the next day she changes her thoughts and is unsure.

I think you answered your own question here. If there are any doubts (... I'm pretty sure... she changes her thoughts...) then I think wait. Time has a way to answer all questions. The second visa process will be just as long as the first but you will have the opportunity, together, to clearly evaluate things before you make this second application. (I have been told recently that in 10 years you can only make 2 - K1 applications so next time you better be sure or be prepared to wait a lot longer).
Good luck to you and your lady. Do the right thing for yourselves and each other. Be happy.

Posted by: joelunchbox

I think your question is: How do I differentiate between pre-nuptial jitters and real second thoughts? You sit down, you go over all the emails you sent back and forth. You talk about the funny things that have happened and you go over the times you argued. When you are done you should have some perspective on things. I may have missed if this is you first marriage? Your age?

Posted by: firemansam

For me, if it's not 100% from both sides, then don't do it. Too many relationships end up in pain as it is and these are the ones without any time frames on them. (Unless there is a shotgun involved!

) For my thoughts though, if there is any indecision, then do not go ahead and if necessary, yes! Re-apply for the K-1 visa. Do not get married just for the sake of convenience. It could really end up in a S#!ty place and I am sure you do not want that...

Best of luck,

Sam.

Posted by: bingism

There is of course a slightly different take on this... sometimes you can simply "over-think" and "over-analyse"... eventually you both have to make a conscious decision:

"Is this the person I am going to love and be with forever?"

This is a conscious decision that needs to be made. The fairy tale doesn't exist! You have to put time and effort into a relationship, especially after the lustful honeymoon period has passed. So, my advice (contrary to some other opinions), sit down together and ask yourselves the above question. If you can't answer it, don't do it. If you can, but there is still a few "what ifs..." maybe you just need to go for it. No easy answers here

Posted by: Texas Proud

OK.... I will take the different approach....

TALK... is it really doubt or pre marriage nerves.... I know a few people who have gotten married and had many times questioned if it was the right thing to do... my sister even walked out of the ceremony.... her nerves had gotten to her... most are still married....

See if you can get an extension quickly... just pay the money and don't worry about it.... it would be much worse having her go back and trying again...

BUT, my caution... you have already been together for a couple of months... any bad signs yet??? Even if there were... it might not be all bad.. another sister after getting married had a bad spell as he was yelling all the time etc... well, it was that all women had left him and he insecure... once things settled down it was OK... some bumps, but nothing she can not handle..... now married for 30 plus years...

Posted by: joelunchbox

And let's look ahead to the seven year itch...at some point after you are married you will have some doubts...same issues but different aspect. If we all walked at the first sign of trouble, shoot, I might not have gotten much past ringing the doorbell. Dang it, she took 30 seconds too long to answer the door! I am outa here!! haha

Posted by: GoingToRussia

You are the only one that knows if you should tie the knot. Only you know your situation and therfore know what is best to do.

You can only have 1 K-1 in a 2 year timeframe. So wen she leaves, she can not retrun for 2 years. You can get married in Belarus and bring her to the USA on a K-3 at anytime. You are allowed 1 K-1 and 1 K-3 in a 2 year timeframe and 2 K-1s and 2 K-3s in a 10 year timeframe. I never heard of a waiver for a K-1 except if she must leave for an a good reason, death in family. I was told after 90 days ... that's it ... no extentions. I might be wrong about this tough, just never heard of it. I think our country needs a longer K-1 visa timeframe.

Good luck with your decision.

Posted by: TimmyJ

Hello to Everyone!!!

Thank you to all you have offered your thoughts and opinions on my questions. Our days feel so tense now and we take one day at a time to make our decisions. Having a finacee over from the FSU is much tougher than (I / We) thought. It is not easy.... If anyone tells you otherwise they are not telling you the truth.

Anyway, Natalie will be here about 3 more weeks and I hope that all will have a good and Happy ending.

Going To Russia - This is my 2nd K - 1 Visa since year 2004. I have not done any K - 3's ever. So it looks like I used up all my allowances for the K - 1? Is this correct? Natalie did say that she would want us to try again soon! but this what gets me confused if we were meant to be together than why not now? She must have more on her mind that she is willing to speak about. Maybe it is just my thoughts running away from me!

Wishing you all Love and Happiness!

Regards,
Timmy

Posted by: GoingToRussia

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimmyJ

Hello to Everyone!!!

Thank you to all you have offered your thoughts and opinions on my questions. Our days feel so tense now and we take one day at a time to make our decisions. Having a finacee over from the FSU is much tougher than (I / We) thought. It is not easy.... If anyone tells you otherwise they are not telling you the truth.

Anyway, Natalie will be here about 3 more weeks and I hope that all will have a good and Happy ending.

Going To Russia - This is my 2nd K - 1 Visa since year 2004. I have not done any K - 3's ever. So it looks like I used up all my allowances for the K - 1? Is this correct? Natalie did say that she would want us to try again soon! but this what gets me confused if we were meant to be together than why not now? She must have more on her mind that she is willing to speak about. Maybe it is just my thoughts running away from me!

Wishing you all Love and Happiness!

Regards,
Timmy

Yes Timmy, your next K-1 visa cannot be until 2014. You can only receive K-3 visas until then.

My wife had reservations about coming to the USA on a K-3. She eventually divorced me and never signed the K-3. In the long run I know it was the right decision and we remain friends. I am also now involved with a women from Moldova. I will be with her in 3 weeks. I hope to have her here next year.

It sounds like the decision is up to her. If she can't make a decision then I say no to marriage.

Good luck ...

Posted by: TimmyJ

Hello GTR!

How are you doing! Thank you so much for your responses and imput. I appreciate it a lot! GTR, I am so sorry to hear that you had to go through a divorce with your previous wife! I am trying everything to avoid going through a painful divorce, I know that it would devastate me for a while. I am a single man age 51 and I have never been married before. I want to go through marriage once and I want it to last forever ~smile~ Natalie has been married once before and she is divorced so this would be her 2nd marriage.

Did you have a pre-nup? I discussed one with my lady and she did not seem to have a problem with it. Are these FSU ladies entitled to our assets even after a short marriage let say if it lasts 1 to 3 years? Can you shed some light on this topic? Thanks much.

Wishing you Love and Happiness!

Regards,
Timmy

Posted by: Jerico

Well first of all a prenup may not protect you.
Your previous assets may be protected but future retirement from the point of marriage she can try to get as well as Social security.
I have no prenup with my wife but I already own my house and other household items ( ie: cars , motorcycles)
DOnt think she can touch them because i owned them BEFORE MARRIAGE.
Now if i sell my house and buy a bigger one? Ya she gets half I suppose.
Jerry

Posted by: Longfellow

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimmyJ

Did you have a pre-nup? I discussed one with my lady and she did not seem to have a problem with it. Are these FSU ladies entitled to our assets even after a short marriage let say if it lasts 1 to 3 years? Can you shed some light on this topic? Thanks much.

remember that pre-nup can be contested on grounds of full disclousure and informed consent. With a foreigner, this requires that the legal language be adequately translated (we can't even seem to translate 'legal-ize' into English) and consultation of a native lawyer to explain the ramifications. Even in best of circumstances, between 2 natives of USA and seperate lawyers on each behalf, the court can and does find reason to disqualify the validity of pre-nups.
What is yours prior remains yours after, so long as you do not co-mingle i.e. she is contributing to the mortgage payment. Everything else is on the block.
Good luck

Posted by: Texas Proud

Hmmm....

Reading between the lines.... you had someone else over on a K-1 and decided not to marry (for some reason.. who knows but you)..

You now have another woman over on a k-1 and have decided not to marry... again only you and her know...

This does not sound like a good track record to me... but hey, I am a harsh person on these boards...

BTW... there IS a way to get another K-1.. but you have to ask for a waiver to the law... since the law is so new, nobody (that I have read) has requested it... AND.. your earlier K-1 might not count since it was before the law.. when you are ready, call or send and email and ask...

As for you assets.... each state is different and nobody can tell you what you have to do except someone in that state (and hopefully tells you correctly).. do you have a large estate to protect? And if you are 'sure' like you say, why a prenup? Sure, if you are Paul McCartney with a billion.. then maybe so (but the idiot did not want one)...

In Texas, separate property remains separate even after marriage... but you have to be careful that you do not 'convert' separate property into marital property... this can happen to different bank and investment accounts if you co-mingle funds.. it can lose it's 'separate' status as nobody know how much separate money or marital money is in the account if you move it back and forth... read up on your state laws and follow what they say... again.. for Texas.. interest and dividend income is 'marital' even off separate properties, but capital gains are 'separate'... I believe in Cali that cap gains is marital... see the problems??

Posted by: joelunchbox

I am suddenly reminded of a Groucho Marx quote, "Love goes out the door when Money comes inuendo". If you are this worried about the financial aspects of this relationship...bail. If you can't see that a) she will bring something other than money into the relationship or b) you don't trust her with your money......run away. You are being honest, congratulations. You should be learning from this--next time, bring this up EARLY in the relationship so it can be dealt with BEFORE she pulls ups roots, leaves her home and travels half way around the world to be with you.
If this seems a little harsh, I am sorry. But, we guys often forget that there is a cost to the women that trust us when they come here. I don't know you or her or the specifics of the relationship but generally, this holds true.

Posted by: Longfellow

Quote:

Originally Posted by joelunchbox

I am suddenly reminded of a Groucho Marx quote, "Love goes out the door when Money comes inuendo". If you are this worried about the financial aspects of this relationship...bail. If you can't see that a) she will bring something other than money into the relationship or b) you don't trust her with your money......run away. You are being honest, congratulations. You should be learning from this--next time, bring this up EARLY in the relationship so it can be dealt with BEFORE she pulls ups roots, leaves her home and travels half way around the world to be with you.
If this seems a little harsh, I am sorry. But, we guys often forget that there is a cost to the women that trust us when they come here. I don't know you or her or the specifics of the relationship but generally, this holds true.

Wow, Joe, that reads almost poetic! You have a real talent for words and to cut through all the icing and get to the cake of the matter. (Maybe you're Dr. Phil lurking in RMP!)
I think you pounded the nail square - it certainly gives me valuable insight to consider and continually challenge myself against in own thought processes.
I am really grateful to this board. It has opened my eyes in a thousand ways as well as offering a continuing resource to reflect back to me what I think I see and the occasional dousing of chilly water to ensure I am really awake!
That's enough hero worship out of me. Wouldn't want you all to figure out I'm a schoolgirl with a crush... DOH!

Posted by: GoeastLJ

[QUOTE=TimmyJI am a single man age 51 and I have never been married before. I want to go through marriage once and I want it to last forever ~smile~ Natalie has been married once before and she is divorced so this would be her 2nd marriage.

Did you have a pre-nup? I discussed one with my lady and she did not seem to have a problem with it. Are these FSU ladies entitled to our assets even after a short marriage let say if it lasts 1 to 3 years? Can you shed some light on this topic? [/QUOTE]

Well, it sounds like your heart is not in it Jimmy (yet). She is not sure, you are not sure and you want to experiment ... as long as it does not turn out to be an expensive experiment.

I know it can be painful to lose your property after being in a sort and loveless relationship, but I think I would concentrate on building up the relationship now and only bringing in your wealth (pre-nup, etc) once you are both sure that you want to be together longterm.

If you are not sure, why not let her go and then try to build the relationship while she is back home? You have been together in your home and she may not be sure about committing to a marriage just now, but she (and you) would have enough time to think about it and make a proper unrushed decision. It might be expensive and painful but it may save you a lot of headaches.

All the same, the two of you are the only ones best placed to make a decision. Whatever you decide, best of luck.

Posted by: GoingToRussia

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimmyJ

Hello GTR!

How are you doing! Thank you so much for your responses and imput. I appreciate it a lot! GTR, I am so sorry to hear that you had to go through a divorce with your previous wife! I am trying everything to avoid going through a painful divorce, I know that it would devastate me for a while. I am a single man age 51 and I have never been married before. I want to go through marriage once and I want it to last forever ~smile~ Natalie has been married once before and she is divorced so this would be her 2nd marriage.

Did you have a pre-nup? I discussed one with my lady and she did not seem to have a problem with it. Are these FSU ladies entitled to our assets even after a short marriage let say if it lasts 1 to 3 years? Can you shed some light on this topic? Thanks much.

Wishing you Love and Happiness!

Regards,
Timmy

Thanks Timmy, but my divorce was for the best. Now that I really know her, she was keeping many secrets, we would have eventually divorced. Everyone is always on their best behavior at first. You really don't know someone until you live with them for many months at least.

Welcome to the club, I was married for the first time when I was 51.

Funny you should ask about a pre-nup ... she wanted one for her!!!

She is a successful business women. Owns 2 businesses and 3 pieces of property. She is probably the smartest person I ever met. No I didn't get a pre-nup. I doubt if a pre-nup would help. Part of a K-1 is signing a I-864. This document says you WILL support her during her stay in the USA. This support expires in many ways. One is when she gets her green card. If she has children, I think you must pay support until the age of 18. Texas proud is correct. Divorce laws vary from state to state.

It is now 4 weeks now until I am with my girl. Plane fare too expensive. If I wait 1 week, the price drops $600!!! I'm waiting.

Best of luck Timmy.

Posted by: Spakoyna

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoingToRussia

Part of a K-1 is signing a I-864. This document says you WILL support her during her stay in the USA. This support expires in many ways. One is when she gets her green card. If she has children, I think you must pay support until the age of 18.

I do not know about the child support issue. But when you sign an I-864 you are giving the government a gaurantee that you will pay for any government based services your wife may require until she has paid into social security for 40 quarters! That is a minimum of 10 years! This is anything the government might have to fork out for...healthcare,welfare,unemployment, etc! It amazes me how so many people do not inderstand this.A greencard does not release a man from these responsabilities!

Posted by: GoingToRussia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spakoyna

You are also released from I-864 responsibilities if they become a citizen which can be less then 10 years.

Posted by: Spakoyna

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoingToRussia

You are also released from I-864 responsibilities if they become a citizen which can be less then 10 years.

I believe you might be right. If they become a citizen you are released from responsibility...but a greencard does not release responsibility!

Posted by: TimmyJ

Hello All!

Many Thanks to all of you who have posted your comments and opinions here to my questions. They were all helpful and it brought me some comfort. Well I popped the big question to my Natalie this weekend and I proposed to her and she accepted!!!

I am 51 and this is my very first marriage. I am taking a very big step in my life and I know that this will bring some changes into my daily life. I have met 2 ladies prior to Natalie over the past 4 years and this one I feel the most surest with and I believe that it will work out very well. The 1st lady that I met could have come to a disastrous end if we got married. She was too entreprenurial she was too interested in money. She was very head-strong and very controlling. Things had to be her way and when things did not go her way, Look out!!! She would just explode.... I have done a K-1 for her and when it was time for her to go to the American Embassy for her Fiancee interview she got cold feet and she bowed out! She came up with every excuse that she could not go along with it! Ah, she was her Mums only child, only daughter. America is too far from home and what about we go move to Switzerland for a few years. Ah Huh!!! Yeah right!!! She knew right from the get go what she was up against and she just played along for a while. It was an emotional and stressful time for me at that particular moment in time. Much effort and money was spent and it was all for nothing!

I am well aware of the I-864 form that I had to sign. I know that I am obligated to support a woman for at least 10 years. Natalie told me that she wants to go to work as soon as possible and that she will share the expenses.

Now we are making marriage plans. I think that we will tie the knot in a civil wedding in Las Vegas and then we will have a church wedding in the Fall near home.

Well this is my latest update and we have much to do these next 2 weeks!

Wishing All of you Love and Happiness!

Regards,
Timmy

Posted by: Rockyof Florida

Timmy,
Congrats and hope everything works out for you. Sure it is a big step, but one worth taking. Best of luck to the two of you!!!!

Rocky

Posted by: Lanny

Wow, Timmy, call me a skeptic, but as an attorney for 28 years I have dealt with my share of other peoples' family problems. At age 57 (widowed after 34 years of marriage), I am about to make my first trip to Belarus (Minsk) to meet the 53-year-old woman whom I have no doubt that I will be marrying the week that she arrives in the U.S. on her K-1. (Her sister is now a U.S. citizen living in Arizona, so this is not the typical Russian dating situation.) Anyway, the uncertainty in all of your e-mails would make me think long and hard about getting married in a "shotgun wedding" in a couple of weeks (the shotgun being the expiration of her K-1). With this amount of uncertainty and concern about a pre-nup, there are red flags all over the place. It's difficult to believe that all of the concerns expressed in your original e-mail have evaporated in a week. I truly wish you the best and hope that this works out, but even with my own fiance I am painfully aware that this decision could pretty well ruin two lives if it doesn't work out. Concerning a pre-nup, I have taken the opposite approach -- everything that I own, and I mean everything that I own, is already in her name because I want her to know from the start that this is a binding commitment and that she is going to be fully protected if anything happens to me. I even took out $500,000 in life insurance -- which, even at age 57, is less than $100 a month. Anyway, I don't mean to sound as though I am lecturing because this is all new to me as well -- but if I were you, I would schedule some heavy-duty counseling sessions with a pastor or marriage counselor during the next two weeks to make sure that the two of you really are on the same page. Just my $0.02 worth (or perhaps $100.02 worth, since I am a lawyer!).

Lanny

Posted by: Chrismc

Good advice Lanny and welcome by the way! good to hear another point of view and a different way of looking at the subject also.

Chris

Posted by: bingism

Well... what can I say?!? Maybe I'm feeling surprisingly positive, but sometimes you have to go all-in to win the hand...

the stakes are high, but I'm sure you know that

Posted by: TimmyJ

Hello Lanny!

How are you doing! Thank you so much for your help and imput. I apologize for my long silence.

Well, I have some things to tell you since my last posting here. Natalie and I made decisions to marry, we made some purchases and I bought her a nice dress for her to wear on our big day.

Last week Natalie and I made our last stop to our attorney's office to read and sign our nup agreement which she fully agreed to. This day started out to be a very stressful one because this was the day we would get these formalities out of the way. When we met with our lawyers she would not sign an amendment to the pre-nup because she said that she did not fully understand it. I am a gentleman and I would never force her to sign or do anything that she was not comfortable with.

Later that same day we caught a non-stop flight for a romantic vacation to Las Vegas and our thoughts was to get married there. To make a long story shorter we did go to Las Vegas and we truly had a magnificient time there together. We got along superbly but we did not tie the knot there because we both agreed that it was not the right moment for us to marry.

Now Natalie's time here is coming to an end and she must return home because we don't want to risk our chances of us being together again in the future. We both agreed that this was for our best interests and that we would try again later. Natalie is truly a wonderful person and this experience enriched my life. I hope that things will be better the next time around. Three months may seem to be long but it really is not a great amount of time when it comes to making a big decision in life like getting married.

I wish you Lanny and all of you here Love and Happiness. I am always Happy to hear what you have to say.

Best Regards,
Timmy

Posted by: GoingToRussia

Hi Timmy,

I saw you on-line today. How are things going? Are you still with Natalie?

I plan on being married in Las Vegas next month.

Take care and gook luck!

Posted by: dagpop

G, don't make plans so soon. Anything can happen. I would wait until she is on american soil.