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Please need advise/help.. scam?
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Posted by: mk01

Hi to everyone out there.. I want to first say thank you for any advise/support provided.. and I will try to make this brief and to the point. I am more than happy to clarify or provide additional information if inquired..

I have been corresponding with a girl from Russia for over 1 year. And she seems to be genuine but recently I have been having doubts. Between the two of us we have written over 500 email letters in the past year. It's been going back and forth, I would write and she would correspond; vice versa. We've shared a lot in our emails from what we expect from our relationship to everyday life. Her English has been decent and she seems to be attentive with questions and comments that I ask her in my email. There would be a few times where I didn't get a response to my questions but for the most part she would answer and address any questions that I had. We've shared and send lots of pictures with each other. I have even sent postal letters to her which she received. (Initially she did not want to give her address out because of family concerns but after a few months of inquiring I was able to obtain it.)

Unfortunately she says she does not have a phone but we have talked over the phone a few times (through her friend's phone). I've kept the numbers which she would call me from and they have been consistent between 2 numbers. We've talked about meeting. First we talked about myself going to Russia then her coming over here to the States. The first conversation, it was poor timing with my schedule to tavelling over there. So nothing much came from it. The second time it was her coming over here. She had the flight itiniery and everything planned out. She said that she had her visa already approved and that she needed cash on hand to prove that she was financially stable to come. She told me that she needed 1400 USD and that she would return it to me once she arrived. (I have done searches online about scams and so forth, and told her that I did not have that kind of money at hand and that if I did, I felt uneasy about sending so much). So that attempt was a bust. (This was about 10 months into our correspondence). During this time, I was suspicious because of her asking for money. I ran some internet searches and read up about the scams and looked at pictures. So I decided that I would create a fake email account and name and write to her. In it, I stated that I was looking for a relationship and happened across her add (which is how we met). She responded that she had already found someone and that she was serious with him and she would no longer respond to me. I was happy and pleased by her respond.

Now it's been about a year and 3 months. Again, we've been writing to each other just about everyday or every other day. This was our 3rd attempt in trying to meet. So the conversation was that she would come over here. She stated that she had 1100 USD saved and she would look into the trip. I was really excited because after a year and 3 months we would finally meet. Now is says that she needs 1000 USD for a permit? I asked her, is that all you need? Your visa is good and everything was ok?? She said to me that she after helping her with the 1000 USD, that is all she needed and the travel agency would guarantee her ticket and flight over here. She even sent another itinery. I looked up the flight numbers, time and dates and they were all legitimate. Ok.. after doing my internet searches I told myself I should at least try to have some faith. I have tried to look over so many pictures from internet scam sights to see if I could find her picture?? (I know this is such a small fraction of what could truly be posted) I also read up about the stories that people have posted but I wasn't sure if she fell into any of these categories. So I sent her 1000 USD. She later emails me saying after receiving the money and heading to the travel agent, someone stole her purse! Wow.. did I feel stupid!! But not only did she email me, she called me right after her email and we had a long discussion. She was crying and felt so aweful about what happened that she didn't know what to do. It really seemed to me that she was in shock. In the back of my mind , I was thinking OMG? How could you do this? But instead, I asked if she was ok and that she wasn't harmed. We talked about the recourse of what happened; going and filing a police report. We talked about her trip over here. I told her there is no way I could send any additional money because I just did not have it nor would I feel secure in doing this again. I hold her that if she could talk with her family members and friends to see if they could help with the money for the stolen 1000 USD, that once she came here, I would give her that so she could pay them back when she returned to Russia. She agreed and said she would try. After about 3-4 days no luck.

What got me was requiring a permit to come to the States?? I wasn't sure what that was. I have a few friends who travel abroad frequently, but unfortunately not to Russia so they didn't know anything about it. So I told myself I would try one other attempt to she how she would respond. I found a flight and collected the information and sent her one final email. I told her that I had purchased a ticket (not true) and that I should have done this at the beginning and informed her about it. I listed the itinery in my email to her. I also said that I talked to a travel agent (not true) and said that everything was paid for and all she had to do was show up at the airport with her identification and visa and the ticket would be there waiting for her. She emailed me back saying that she was happy and excited but without her permit, she still could not travel??

Wow.. have I really been scammed? I lost a 1000 USD with a leap of faith after all that I've tried but now I am really doubting everything. It seems that our relationship of over a year and communicating and doing everything else seems legit. Even writing her with a ficitious email didn't get her to write back. But with losing 1000 USD??

Please any advise would really be appreciated!!

mk01

Posted by: Pin Boy

yes, unfortunately you indeed were scammed. some scammers will play the long con cause the payoff could be so big. $1,000 goes along way in russia. there is no way she could visit you without receiving a visa to enter the united states. a young woman has a VERY VERY slim chance of receiving a tourist visa. i'm surprised you did not come across that in your search into scams. also surprising that you didn't come across the old i'm here at the airport and all i need is a measly thousand dollars and then we will be in each others arms in a day's time. if she did have permission to travel, no one asks how much money they have nor is there any minimum dollar amount needed to travel. and of course the stolen purse is all part of the ruse.

also consider this - what woman who is not fluent in the language would fly halfway around the world to stay with a man she has never met before? it just doesn't happen. the myth that she will deliver herself right to your door is an out and out ripoff.

sorry you were taken advantage of. hope you will stay on this site and learn from others who have been in your shoes. wish you well.

pin boy

Posted by: clark

But the information you've provided points to a complete and total scam. For all the reasons Pin Boy points out and some others as well. Don't rely on her decline on the test email, chances are she spotted you. many scammers are very proficient. Suck it up, cut your losses and move on to possibly a real RW. Good luck to you

Posted by: chippie

Quote:

Originally Posted by mk01

Hi to everyone out there.. I want to first say thank you for any advise/support provided.. and I will try to make this brief and to the point. I am more than happy to clarify or provide additional information if inquired..

I have been corresponding with a girl from Russia for over 1 year. And she seems to be genuine but recently I have been having doubts. Between the two of us we have written over 500 email letters in the past year. It's been going back and forth, I would write and she would correspond; vice versa. We've shared a lot in our emails from what we expect from our relationship to everyday life. Her English has been decent and she seems to be attentive with questions and comments that I ask her in my email. There would be a few times where I didn't get a response to my questions but for the most part she would answer and address any questions that I had. We've shared and send lots of pictures with each other. I have even sent postal letters to her which she received. (Initially she did not want to give her address out because of family concerns but after a few months of inquiring I was able to obtain it.)

Unfortunately she says she does not have a phone but we have talked over the phone a few times (through her friend's phone). I've kept the numbers which she would call me from and they have been consistent between 2 numbers. We've talked about meeting. First we talked about myself going to Russia then her coming over here to the States. The first conversation, it was poor timing with my schedule to tavelling over there. So nothing much came from it. The second time it was her coming over here. She had the flight itiniery and everything planned out. She said that she had her visa already approved and that she needed cash on hand to prove that she was financially stable to come. She told me that she needed 1400 USD and that she would return it to me once she arrived. (I have done searches online about scams and so forth, and told her that I did not have that kind of money at hand and that if I did, I felt uneasy about sending so much). So that attempt was a bust. (This was about 10 months into our correspondence). During this time, I was suspicious because of her asking for money. I ran some internet searches and read up about the scams and looked at pictures. So I decided that I would create a fake email account and name and write to her. In it, I stated that I was looking for a relationship and happened across her add (which is how we met). She responded that she had already found someone and that she was serious with him and she would no longer respond to me. I was happy and pleased by her respond.

Now it's been about a year and 3 months. Again, we've been writing to each other just about everyday or every other day. This was our 3rd attempt in trying to meet. So the conversation was that she would come over here. She stated that she had 1100 USD saved and she would look into the trip. I was really excited because after a year and 3 months we would finally meet. Now is says that she needs 1000 USD for a permit? I asked her, is that all you need? Your visa is good and everything was ok?? She said to me that she after helping her with the 1000 USD, that is all she needed and the travel agency would guarantee her ticket and flight over here. She even sent another itinery. I looked up the flight numbers, time and dates and they were all legitimate. Ok.. after doing my internet searches I told myself I should at least try to have some faith. I have tried to look over so many pictures from internet scam sights to see if I could find her picture?? (I know this is such a small fraction of what could truly be posted) I also read up about the stories that people have posted but I wasn't sure if she fell into any of these categories. So I sent her 1000 USD. She later emails me saying after receiving the money and heading to the travel agent, someone stole her purse! Wow.. did I feel stupid!! But not only did she email me, she called me right after her email and we had a long discussion. She was crying and felt so aweful about what happened that she didn't know what to do. It really seemed to me that she was in shock. In the back of my mind , I was thinking OMG? How could you do this? But instead, I asked if she was ok and that she wasn't harmed. We talked about the recourse of what happened; going and filing a police report. We talked about her trip over here. I told her there is no way I could send any additional money because I just did not have it nor would I feel secure in doing this again. I hold her that if she could talk with her family members and friends to see if they could help with the money for the stolen 1000 USD, that once she came here, I would give her that so she could pay them back when she returned to Russia. She agreed and said she would try. After about 3-4 days no luck.

What got me was requiring a permit to come to the States?? I wasn't sure what that was. I have a few friends who travel abroad frequently, but unfortunately not to Russia so they didn't know anything about it. So I told myself I would try one other attempt to she how she would respond. I found a flight and collected the information and sent her one final email. I told her that I had purchased a ticket (not true) and that I should have done this at the beginning and informed her about it. I listed the itinery in my email to her. I also said that I talked to a travel agent (not true) and said that everything was paid for and all she had to do was show up at the airport with her identification and visa and the ticket would be there waiting for her. She emailed me back saying that she was happy and excited but without her permit, she still could not travel??

Wow.. have I really been scammed? I lost a 1000 USD with a leap of faith after all that I've tried but now I am really doubting everything. It seems that our relationship of over a year and communicating and doing everything else seems legit. Even writing her with a ficitious email didn't get her to write back. But with losing 1000 USD??

Please any advise would really be appreciated!!

mk01

mk01,

I think that most people on this site will tell you that you NEver send money to a woman that you have never met. Never, Never, Never!
I am in the process of obtaining a K1 visa for my fiancee from Bealrus, and the paperwork required is unbelieveable. I have not heard of a "permit". She would need a visa. Generally I do not think that the government will grant a visa to a single woman from Russia. I have heard of visas granted for example if the woman is assured of returning to Russia because she has a child there, or something of that sort.
I think that 98% of the Russian women on this site would tell you that they would NEVER ask for money from a man. They have too much pride. Most of us that have women in Russia or the FSU will tell you that generally our women will not take money from us. We usually have to hide it in a drawer at the apartment or something of the sort and tell them about it at the airport.
My own personal opinion is that it is a hard lesson that cost you $1000. I would also tell you that just because this one lady may have scammed you it does not mean that they are all scammers. It's been my experience that Russian and FSU women are some of the most loving, caring, and amazing women anywhere. You just need to do a little more homework.
In the future if you find a woman that you correspond with and things go well, YOU go visit her. If it is a bust, you will of had a good trip.

Don't be discouraged, but be suspicious with the "red flags".

chippie

Posted by: Dave_N_Elvira

I think you got scammed here but I am left scratching my head at aspects of your story.

First one is the 15 month, 500 e-mail part of it. Enormous amount of time and investment for a scammer. Had one that went for 3 months sending 2 emails a week (roughly 25 emails) who tried to bait me and I thought that was bad. Seems too long for someone to bait you.

Second, scammers very rarely will speak to you on the phone or give you an address. They will make up every excuse under the sun for not being able to. She gave both to you.

Third, what went wrong with your proposed flight? Sounds like you cancelled your flight to see her. Some more elaboration would be nice here as to why you cancelled it. Did you have a time to see her and she said it was no good? Were you just not able to make the time?

Fourth, scammers usually try to bait as many people as they can. Seems strange she would ignore you although if you sent it from the same IP address a computer literate scammer could see this.

Although you broke the golden rule of sending money and this looks a cut and dry scam, it certainly looks a little screwy compared to most scams like this. My gut tells me this was a normal girl to start with, who after being stuffed around for 15 months by you, probably came to the conclusion you would never come and decided to get something out of you. There�s a lot of things scammers don�t do that she did and the story as a whole just doesn�t add up from where I am sitting.

There�s a lot to learnt from this than the simple don�t send money aspect I feel. You come across as someone very indecisive regarding the whole process (15 months!) and with a little bit of decisiveness you could have avoided this whole situation by going to Russia initially like you planned. That way you could seen if she was genuine and if not had the opportunity to meet someone over there that was.

Posted by: ira156

Firstly Welcome MK, Whoa a very elaborate scam in the fact of the time taken and the rejecting your second email enquiry. You dont seem to be bitter though which is a good thing.....it doesnt get you anywhere. Your story will be of great benefit for some newbies down the track. The scam itself is an old one but the way it was executed was devious. I think the Main thing goes back to DONT EVER SEND MONEY......genuine women wont ask....and VISIT THEM...not the other way around. As other posters have said ...genuine women will not want to travel to the other side of the world...they would rather see you in there own country. And in doing it this way ....if it doesnt work out....You have a great holiday anyway...good luck in the future...there are some great ladies out there

Posted by: mk01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave_N_Elvira

I think you got scammed here but I am left scratching my head at aspects of your story.

First one is the 15 month, 500 e-mail part of it. Enormous amount of time and investment for a scammer. Had one that went for 3 months sending 2 emails a week (roughly 25 emails) who tried to bait me and I thought that was bad. Seems too long for someone to bait you.

Second, scammers very rarely will speak to you on the phone or give you an address. They will make up every excuse under the sun for not being able to. She gave both to you.

Third, what went wrong with your proposed flight? Sounds like you cancelled your flight to see her. Some more elaboration would be nice here as to why you cancelled it. Did you have a time to see her and she said it was no good? Were you just not able to make the time?

Fourth, scammers usually try to bait as many people as they can. Seems strange she would ignore you although if you sent it from the same IP address a computer literate scammer could see this.

Although you broke the golden rule of sending money and this looks a cut and dry scam, it certainly looks a little screwy compared to most scams like this. My gut tells me this was a normal girl to start with, who after being stuffed around for 15 months by you, probably came to the conclusion you would never come and decided to get something out of you. There�s a lot of things scammers don�t do that she did and the story as a whole just doesn�t add up from where I am sitting.

There�s a lot to learnt from this than the simple don�t send money aspect I feel. You come across as someone very indecisive regarding the whole process (15 months!) and with a little bit of decisiveness you could have avoided this whole situation by going to Russia initially like you planned. That way you could seen if she was genuine and if not had the opportunity to meet someone over there that was.

We have been talking for quite some time.. we definitely emailed each other often.. sometimes 2 -3 times a day. it was pretty constistent. I thought that the time invested and effort to write and anticipate emails from each other was legit. This and the fact that our emails were detailed and the way we responded to each other once we received our letters.

As for the address and phone numbers, yes I got both.. but it took a couple of months.. When I first requested this information there was hesitation, but she insisted that we didn't know each other well enough, but after our relationship developed and I inquired again, she gave it to me.

As for the me flying over there, it was unfortunately my schedule that didn't work out. There really wasn't hesitation on my end, but poor timing. She was understanding why I couldn't make it. Unfortunately the following discussions about us meeting weren't about me going there but her coming here. I should have just kept the thought of just visiting her.

I never thought about the IP address when I sent the other email. I was not aware that it would be the same and I can't say whether she saw this or not. But her response of already seeing someone and being in a serious relationship seem to be realistic. But then again.. I don't know for sure.

It seems a hard lesson learned. Especially after sending the money and hearing the story of it being stolen. I didn't expect things to be perfect but I figured the amount of time and effort put into our correspondence and the amount of patience needed, especially with this length of time, I thought maybe there was some trust and faith that we had between us.

mk01

Posted by: Texas Proud

I am with Dave.... sound very fishy as a story... I can't tell if it is the writer scamming or the girl... but, I don't have to make a decision as I am not sending money... and why would someone write a story like this just to get reponses??? SOOOO...

MK... how long was it before someone suggested to see each other???

where did you see her ad?

Give her name and address... there are people on this site that seem to be able to find anybody (not me though)...((I mean I can't find someone, not that they can't find me

)

How old are you and how old is she? (age makes a difference)...

And I agree that 15 months is a long time for a scam... and all those emails etc.... but I would vote on the side of scam in the end...

Posted by: Dave_N_Elvira

Mk,
I can understand where you are coming from. Seems to be an incredible amount of work and a meticulously detailed effort to scam you. Don�t be too disheartened. I got played for around 5 months when I was a noob to all this and it cost me around $1,000 as well. Been played a few times since but never stupid enough to send money again. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.

Don�t be too disheartened by all this. Sure you got played this time but you will find a fair few on here that had to sift through the sand before finding their diamonds. Try to take positives from it and use it as a learning experience. Can take a long time to find your diamond. Took me 27 months but it was worth it.

Finding this group will put you on the right track. Plenty of resources here and wise old (and some young) heads here to help you out. One thing that did concern me about your story was the time you spent corresponding without visiting. You need to be aware that even when you find someone genuine, they are likely to lose patience if left dangling for 15 months.

Another thing you need to know is written correspondence is fraught with danger. The market is overrun with scammers. They drove me crazy at the correspondence stage and eventually I just gave up doing the written thing altogether. I simply chose a place I wanted to visit in Russia, scouted out an agency and used the matchmaking services they had. Far more efficient way IMHO and much easier to tell if a woman is genuine and interested in you from observing body language and behaviour in person. Saves wasting countless hours and enduring disappointment like you have. After you�ve met then start writing and you can do so in the knowledge that the woman is genuine.

Posted by: I/O

Dead set scam fro go to wo this one. She (Or more likely them) is a professional scammer. They are very well organised and after all it is their job, so wouldn't they invest time? Time is your best defence, but it is no garrentee.

1) The pros will not resopond positively to your approach (Usually) for several reasons. Not least of all, as has been pointed out, they are savvy to ISP's etc. Usually THEY pick there mark with a few baits and it would be interesting to know if this guy received a few approaches at about the time he started with this one.

2) The usual, I need money to prove stability...Total nonsense.

3) Permit...??? What permit..??? Again total nonsense.

4) She sounds like she was resisitant to giving an address. Why.?? She knows you wont turn up on her doorstep in 5 minutes. More nonsense. (From my own experience)

5) Travel itinary that checks out. Yeah...seen that too. I had one of them about 2 years back and yes the itinerary checked out. So what? Just as easy for them to check possible intineraries online also.

Bottom line is that she played this guy like a finely tuned fiddle. She (Or them) is probably not working alone.

Quote:

I think that 98% of the Russian women on this site would tell you that they would NEVER ask for money from a man.

True...!!!

Quote:

what woman who is not fluent in the language would fly halfway around the world to stay with a man she has never met before? it just doesn't happen.

Wrong...!! Mine did.

Quote:

I think that most people on this site will tell you that you NEver send money to a woman that you have never met. Never, Never, Never!

Again, I did so there is not a hard and fast rule.

I will qualify my last 2 remarks by saying that there was a number of things about the relationship between mine and I which were far from the ordinary. Very far in fact.

The first thing anyone should do if he thinks, I repeat thinks she will come to visit him is this......Pay for her tourist visa application which you can do in your own country. Approximately $50 USD and then send the receipt to her to lodge with her application. There is no way she will receive a tourist visa without your sponsorship in some form, and as sponsor you ARE entitled to enquire of the embassy if the visa has been granted.

So what do you lose then? $50..not much to run a test.

If and I repeat if, you go to the next step, then pay for her tickets with your credit card. Don't send her the cash. (Again, I did, but again, our situation was very far from the ordinary and by this time I had sighted the visa and a number of other matters and further I was in direct communication with the airline/s about the ticketing. There is more but no to be mentioned here)

The first basic win for any potential scammer is the victum is trying to get something for nothing or at a reduced cost. Here we have a situation where it is a better deal for the victum to have her come to him than it is for him to go to her. I am sorry to sound harsh here, but this is the reality.

The greatest con artists in history have said that the most difficult man to con is the one who is prepared to pay his way and is not trying to get something for nothing. The problem here is that he thought he could out smart her and got fryed. Again an example that it is harder to con the person who is doing everything on the up and up. The writer by his own admission was not.

I admit to having gotten very close to being a victum myself a long time ago, before I woke up and did the obvious, that is, went to the embassy website to check on visa requirements and guess what?

The embassy website was littered with warnings. Surprise surprise.

I have a good deal of sympathy for this guy and I understand how it can hurt, but at the end of the day, put it down to experience and move on. The sun will come up tomorrow morning.

At the end of the day, generally speaking, you cant sit at home and "Order in love".

Posted by: mk01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Texas Proud

I am with Dave.... sound very fishy as a story... I can't tell if it is the writer scamming or the girl... but, I don't have to make a decision as I am not sending money... and why would someone write a story like this just to get reponses??? SOOOO...

MK... how long was it before someone suggested to see each other???

where did you see her ad?

Give her name and address... there are people on this site that seem to be able to find anybody (not me though)...((I mean I can't find someone, not that they can't find me

Well to help answer the questions... We have discussed seeing each other, but it wasn't until about 10 months into the correspondence did I suggest that we meet. Why so long into the relationship? Not sure really, but I had my doubts at the beginning (and maybe it took me that long to realize it was a legit relationship) and I suppose as our relationship grew the doubts slowly went away and that is why I thought after such a long time and for her requesting the money, it might have been true. Unfortunately I did sent the money by western union which from my part was a hard lesson learned.

I have posted my ad in a singles site (not sure if I can mention here - but if no rules against it, I'm more than happy too). She initially saw my profile and contacted me and that's how our relationship began.

Her first name is Ekaterina.. But after our relationship developed she would sign her letters with katyusha, which I inquired and she told me that was like a 'pet' name. She lives in Omsk, Russia. As the exact last name and address.. I'm not sure if rules are against posting her complete profile or not but I do have that. Again I have sent her letters and we have talked over the phone.

I would love to have someone see if they could find her!! I've tried so many different sites and gone through so many pictures. I do have several pictures of her but again, I don't know if that would do any good and if it would be appropriate.

My age is 32 and she is 27.

If there is any other information that would be helpeful I'd be more than happy to share. I appreciate the responses and advice from everyone.

I will say one thing.. I am very disappointed (and heart broken) over this. Any bitterness? maybe to a slight degree. I'm more sadden. The way we corresponded and wrote to each other, it seemed to be a wonderful, developing and potentially great relationship. It's just disheartening to invite this much time (and money at the end) to come to this realization.

mk01

Posted by: I/O

Quote:

Originally Posted by mk01

Mate, PM me with some details if you really want to check it out, I have someone on the ground in Omsk who would be happy to do that for you.

Frankly, I think there is no way she will check out and depending on the site you met, I can take a fair guess by the description as to who, or at least which profile it is.

Posted by: mk01

Quote:

Originally Posted by I/O

Thank you!! I would love to know if she is ficticious or genuine! I have sent you a pm!

Thank you,

mk

Posted by: Dave_N_Elvira

Quote:

Originally Posted by mk01

I have posted my ad in a singles site (not sure if I can mention here - but if no rules against it, I'm more than happy too). She initially saw my profile and contacted me and that's how our relationship began.

Hate to tell you this but 90% of women who initiate contact this way are scammers.

Posted by: Dave_N_Elvira

Quote:

Originally Posted by mk01

Thank you!! I would love to know if she is ficticious or genuine! I have sent you a pm!

Thank you,
mk

Fire me a pm with her full name and city of residence as well. Can have a look for you as well.

Posted by: mk01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave_N_Elvira

Fire me a pm with her full name and city of residence as well. Can have a look for you as well.

Thank you!! I appreciate this so much! Please see ur pm..

mk

Posted by: bingism

I really think that we need to stop talking about the long-termness of this, or any, scam. Play 50 guys out for 15-months, adding one new guy every week and scamming one every week, then after 15-months investment of time you've got a $50k a year business going! If I had $50k a year here then I'd live like the Prince of Dubai (well, sort of...)

Posted by: RRR

Please keep us updated with any findings. I think we could learn something from this.

Posted by: nocomfortzone

hmmm. Dave's thoughts echo a lot of mine.

It certainly ends up sounding like a scam but for the length of time and amount of e-mails it had me scratching my head aswell after reading it.
500 e-mails wow! Maybe they were just a few lines each rather than a couple of pages each.

I thought to myself that length of time writing to each other without meeting was getting a bit long in the tooth and maybe she just lost faith in you coming and then got bitter and all faith and trust was lost. From your side you can sense that from your writing that you had some doubts by your indirect methods
of second guessing her etc. with fake e-mail address you set up to write to her from.

The length of time i took great interest in as i corresponded with my Nat for nearly 9 months before i visited and in hindsight i think that was a bit too long for various reasons. The initial serious thoughts of meeting started to take place after about 4 months off the top of my head and i looked at flights schedules etc. but i figured it was too freezing to visit in winter so i waited till winter was over before going and even then i did not bother booking flights, getting passport and visa until very late but in my own mind i'd already made up my mind of going but that does not mean Nat in her own mind could be completely confident i meant that and the occassionaly doubt may have arose to my seriousness. That is what went through my mind as i read some of your e-mail that the supposed lady you were talking to may have had serious doubt your were really serious and she may have felt her hopes got raised for soemething that would never eventuate and *then* she just doubted everything about you, got bitter and you saw another side to her that lead to screwing you over like a scammer would. It's always possible she was not a scammer but ended up behaving like one. If that's the case, she might aswell be one anyway. What is the saying?, if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck.....

Posted by: Texas Proud

MK...

I would like to hear also what others find out about her.....

Here is what I expect from the little info....

She is not a 'pro' scammer... that she was real, but that she has been burned by a few guys... now she is looking to get something out of the relationship before he moves on... this might be because she has heard that this is what is 'normal' or that she expects this from any man.... that you did not throw money at her and she had a fit... but in the end, you did get scammed... now she might see how easy it was and start to do this to others... either way, you are lucky that you found it out before you got married.... a broken relationship is better than a broken marriage...

Posted by: mk01

Hi Everyone..

This is definitely a difficult time for me. I am trying to find answers where at the end there may not be anything at all. Thanks to a few people, we are searching into this whole ordeal. I will try to keep you posted as events unfold.

I do want to address the scorned female/partner aspect that a few people have brought up. Although I cannot say this is true or not, I personally doubt this be the case. Our relationship and correspondence has been great. We have talked many times about the direction of our relationship, short term and long. Not once has she or I voiced frustration over not seeing each other. Please don't get me wrong, there have been times that we missed each other dearly and noted that in letter or by phone, but we both understood the situation (distance wise) and kept encouraging each other that when we did meet, it would have been the perfect embracing of the two of us. I do understand that 15 months is a very long time. Maybe the amount of emails we wrote to each other kept us going? Maybe the thought of us being together at the end kept us holding on?? And if this was not a scam, maybe the love we had for each other kept us strong?? All I can say is that during our letters and conversations, we were very accepting of each other. We shared our thoughts and feelings and supported one another. We were open, honest and it was very sincere..

I speak as if this was not a scam?? It's hard to say because as I mentioned it is hard to believe with the communication and effort put into this relationship that something like this could happen. Yes, as everyone has mentioned there were so many red flags which pointed to it. Yes I should have not sent the money. In hindsight, I did and it was my lost because of the outcome. But I honestly don't believe one bit it was because of the duration of our correspondence and that of a scorn partner. (at least from my point of view)

Again, I have been trying to find answers and I am communicating with people. If anyone else who may have suggestions or could help, I still would really appreciate it. The answers to this, by any means, will not be easy to find, if that at all..

Thanks again to everyone who has helped. I cannot begin to say and show my appreciation to all of you.

mk

Posted by: mk01

Quote:

Originally Posted by nocomfortzone

hmmm. Dave's thoughts echo a lot of mine.

It certainly ends up sounding like a scam but for the length of time and amount of e-mails it had me scratching my head aswell after reading it.
500 e-mails wow! Maybe they were just a few lines each rather than a couple of pages each.
.....

Yes, I do have all 500+ emails. Some are short, but for the most part, they are betwern 1 to 2 paragraphs long. We initially started off by writing a lot! (honeymoon phase) Our emails were around a page long if not longer. I can say that when we wrote questions to each other, we responded with answers and for the most part it seem to be very legit. We both were attentive and looked forward and anticipated for the next letter.

mk

Posted by: Chrismc

Quote:

Originally Posted by bingism

then after 15-months investment of time you've got a $50k a year business going! If I had $50k a year here then I'd live like the Prince of Dubai (well, sort of...)

So has the Bank of Bing opened its doors again in Ufa.....let me know as I may be heading over that way

Posted by: bingism

Sorry - OFF TOPIC

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chrismc

So has the Bank of Bing opened its doors again in Ufa.....let me know as I may be heading over that way

hehe.... well, I spent a few months trying to scam a thousand roubles at a time from poor unsuspecting Boris and Igor, but somehow the business plan just didn't work out!!

Posted by: chippie

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave_N_Elvira

Fire me a pm with her full name and city of residence as well. Can have a look for you as well.

Dave_N_Elvira,

Any luck on mk01's lady??

Chippie

Posted by: Dave_N_Elvira

Nope, no luck finding here by name. Might be using an alias

Posted by: markgm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mk01

PM me name and address and i will do a Russian Postal search of her through there postal service.

Posted by: mk01

Quote:

Originally Posted by markgm

PM me name and address and i will do a Russian Postal search of her through there postal service.

Thank you so much! I really appreciate it! Please check your pm!

mk

Posted by: GoingToRussia

Well there has been a lot of advice and support here, good to see. Let's just remember:

1. Never send money to someone you never met or if you have the tiniest thought of someone being a scam.

2. Trust your gut feeling.

3. Do reseach.

4. One way to make a scammer run is to visit them in their own city.

Hmmm ... sounds like a new thread! Okay guys, what did I miss?

Posted by: markgm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mk01

Thank you so much! I really appreciate it! Please check your pm!

mk

Check your PM MK. I am 99% sure she is a scammer i have Pm'd all the people with that last name to you and the cities they live in but none in Omsk.
Also a search through the russian personals brought up some interesting results for that name there all in Russian of course but i can read 80% of them.

A Russian business search brought up that name and a dating service that has not payed its bill and been disconnected form the internet and closed down..

I have also found her email address and sent to you she has 10 different names with same email address.

Posted by: mk01

Quote:

Originally Posted by markgm

Thanks! I have sent you some additional information. I don't know if it will be of any use. I appreciate your help!

MK

Posted by: firemansam

Quote:

Originally Posted by markgm

Maybe you should change your name to "Magnum GM"

Posted by: markgm

Quote:

Originally Posted by firemansam

Maybe you should change your name to "Magnum GM"

He!!He!! You just worry about your upcoming trip i'm sure A is going to keep you very close to her and most probably the little one as well. Then you will have two that will argue over you like me.

Posted by: Zmejka

Sorry to hear that turned out so. But i wanted to comment on some replies some of the guys made.
First some of you said may be in the beginning she was genuine but 15 months of correspondence without a meeting (or hope for it) made her wanted to take at least something material out of that relationship - simply said made her a scammer. And you believe in this? If a girl was and are genuine nothing will make her a scammer, she just doesn't possess such qualities, she respects other people's money and so on. So please this is very-very wrong to think like that. If she was disappointed in a relationship it would certainly hurt her to stop them - but it would never let her behave like asking sometihng in return.
And what if to make an invitation you should pose like a sponsor for her or something. It will certainly look suspicios for an embassy officer to notice an unmarried man invites an unmarried woman. It will certainly make him think a woman is going to stay there. Usually it's not recomended to tell that you have any relatives or contacts in the US for example - so you'll have no oportunities to stay there through them. The tourist visa is very hard to get - so it's up to a woman present strong proves of her non-immigrant intentions.
And the last - though some women can really express the desire to visit a man but in absolute majority they would want you to visit them first. And may be after your visit if everything works out they would want to look at your place of living.
And one more - don't doubt the intentions of women who contacted you first. They can be as other women you contact first - genuine or not. If it's yahoo personals that proved to be filled with scammers - then i can understand this position. The same goes to some local sites the adresses of those RW can't even know in most cases. But in other cases - there's nothing wrong in initiating contacts from RW. Don't deny them for that.