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Financial Responsibilities...
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Posted by: Emetsky

Hello folks! I recently had a discussion with a friend of mine who is married to a Ukranian lady.

My friend told me that his wife does not help him in paying for the big bills like rent and utilities. She has a job and she only spends for her own needs (mostly clothing) as well as sending some funds to her family back home. She also has her own Bank accounts. She does not do any cooking or laundering and ironing for him.

She told him that since he brought her to this country, it is his responsibility to take care of her. I believe she is referring to the AOS and "taking care of her means proving everything for free, i.e. food, clothing and shelter plus luxuries. She also told him that if only she had known that he is not able to support her, she would not have come over.

Any comments?

Posted by: Jill

She sounds quite selfish to me and possibly just using him.....However, we don't really know her side of the story so there may be more to it.

Posted by: Ade

Hi,

Like Jill says, we aren't hearing her side of the story....but from what we are told, then if it's correct, there doesn't sound to be a healthy relationship there.

Ade

Posted by: Emetsky

My friend told me that one time, he asked her to at least pay for her overseas calls and she refused. She told him that he should have known that it would be like this before she even came over.

Posted by: GaryM

Maybe I've been mis-informed all these years but I thought one of the things about marriage was being a "team" and having "joint" responsibility (which includes financially)? Maybe she should re-read a copy of the wedding vows again to remind herself.

Unless there are some things we don't actually know then it does sound like a very one-sided relationship and he needs to address the problem soon otherwise the marriage isn't going to last very much longer by the sound of things. He needs to talk to her and get this sorted before it gets any worse.

I hope I'm wrong but I there is always a possibility that she has just used him as a way of getting into the US. I guess it's something he needs to start thinking about so he doesn't end up getting taken for a ride.

Posted by: rk288

OK, right, we haven't heard her side of the story but this rings all too familiar to me. I went through a similar situation. The end of it is in my post "Very Intense Now" q.v.

This really sounds like a set up to me. Is there at least any real affection being mutually shared by both of them?

In my case the affection rapidly dwindled after the wedding and the demand for monies to be sent to Ukraine increased exponentially up until the end game which you can see if you read the post.

Have your friend sign on here and let's compare notes...any questions, I would be glad to share my experiences...

Good luck to him...

RK

Posted by: rk288

You can also see more of my experiences in the post "HELP!!!" under Stage 2 relationships...this was the tip of the iceberg and looking back I should never have married this woman...it cost me a lot both financially and emotionally.

I am not finished with it yet...

RK

Posted by: nocomfortzone

Sorry guys, but some of you guys amaze me how easily you'll get married to someone you barely know.

Also remember everyone teaches others how to treat them.
Put more value on yourself so you don't get into these situations where predators take you for a ride.

Surely if you are going to spend your life with someone you make sure you know a lot about each other on a deep level. It's sad how people just follow others in society and think they need to be married but never learn about developing a relationship where they value themself and then identify a partner that has some common values, dreams and visions in life. Reading this story above and rk's it is clear these couples were more strangers when they got married than people ready to merge their lives with same vision and understanding.

Please be more careful with your own life and heart and find someone that will treat your own life as precious as their own.

Posted by: rk288

Planned deception is a flowery guilded veil...

Posted by: nocomfortzone

I really don't understand rk.
Surely there must have been signs before you got married that she was not on the same page or wavelength as you.
If you got married did you discuss things both of mundane everyday things you would share aswell as both your emotional needs and how you like to be treated in a relationship and like to treat them?

I find it hard to believe you did from your story in another thread. I certainly don't for one minute think you deserve any of the heartache or deception you recieved but it seems like you got married to someone you barely knew and with limited ways of communicating to each other that could develop a deep understanding. That's seems like a recipe for a relationship without a solid foundation for the long term of two lifes being merged with similar visions and values.

Posted by: Texas Proud

Quote:

Originally Posted by nocomfortzone

I really don't understand rk.
Surely there must have been signs before you got married that she was not on the same page or wavelength as you.
If you got married did you discuss things both of mundane everyday things you would share aswell as both your emotional needs and how you like to be treated in a relationship and like to treat them?

I find it hard to believe you did from your story in another thread. I certainly don't for one minute think you deserve any of the heartache or deception you recieved but it seems like you got married to someone you barely knew and with limited ways of communicating to each other that could develop a deep understanding. That's seems like a recipe for a relationship without a solid foundation for the long term of two lifes being merged with similar visions and values.

Considering that divorce is between 40% to 50% then I would say there are many millions of people who fit into your category of not knowing the other on a 'deep' level..

And there are some people who hide thier true feelings very well indeed... I have seen both men and women show 'love' to their partner, but when they are not there.. they talk bad about them and cheat behind their back.. and many times will leave them if they find someone better.. and this is not a Russian / other country thing... but same country...

Posted by: OzGuyLooking

Quote:

Originally Posted by nocomfortzone

Sorry guys, but some of you guys amaze me how easily you'll get married to someone you barely know.

I just know i'll get ripped for this either publicly or behind the scenes but I agree with you NCZ. Going OS for a few weeks and deciding to get married to what for all intents and purposes is a complete stranger is a recipe for disaster. To many people don't spend enough time with their SO before they choose the wedded bliss thing that may or may not turn into not wedded bliss and divorce. The guys that go over, and over, and over etc to Russia/Ukrane etc to spend quality time with their SO to me have the right idea. It is harder to keep up a deception for an extended period and any lady not willing to get to know her SO is desperate to get out of her homeland as he may also be a complete nutter.

Posted by: nocomfortzone

Texas Proud. What you said is exactly right. My comments were not meant to be centred on people from these two different cultures marrying. It is my thoughts on people getting married in general when they are just doing what most others do without putting a lot of thought into their own thoughts of what they want and expect in merging two lives together for the rest of their life.
It just seems some people are attracted to this situation of marrying someone from another culture in this mail order bride fashion and they bring the same not well thought out approach to merging two lives together to an even more complicated and difficult merging of two lives. I'm not at all suprised at the failure rate for marriages from same cultures aswell as different cultures.

It seems a lot of people don't learn much from mistakes in relationships that many many people are making and instead of discovering the underlying reasons why these things go wrong, most people just follow the rest of society like sheep and get into very sad situations.

I wish people would take more care of themself first and put a lot of thought into how they are going to be happy with another person for life. It helps if you are already happy in your own skin and your own company but some people don't even like being on their own for any amount of time and yet they think they'll be happier when they add another person to the situation.
Humans are funny :-)

Posted by: rk288

Hey NCZ...

I don't know your background or history in relationships with women from the fsu...

Of course there were signs of difficulties but these difficulties are pretty much guaranteed across cultures like this.

During my visit I hired a translator to be sure that it was understood that the only thing I could promise was "difficult" for at least 1, 2 maybe even 3 years of "new life" in America.

Yes, and with the translator we discussed everything. In fact my then about to be fiancee opened a discussion on how much our meeting was a holiday and that real life would not be. It was a topic we discussed for at least an hour wherein I explained many of the obstacles that I perceived to be in our future if we proceeded...they were all very real...we both agreed...eyes wide open...yes, hers were and I thought mine were...I shouold have waited and gone back for a second meeting...insisted on meeting her friends, her entire family, visiting her workplace, etc...

Imagine, a years worth of correspondence, a file 3 inches thick with letters, countless photos, thousands of minutes on the telephone...sometimes every day for 90 minutes or more. Cheap phone cards are wonderful aren't they?

And then the actual blissful time of meeting in person...my advice...meet more than once as many on this forum have advised...much more than once as the person I flew back with advised...

I guess I was fortunate that I was stung in the way I was. I really believe she was upset that her plane tickets did not go back thru NYC...I think she had a connection she was trying to make here...

Her eyes were wide open on my income but she had no idea about the bills that come along with such an income and the debt that I had accumulated to bring them here in such a short time.

As I wrote here before, if I was a multimillionare with huge disposible discretionary cash maybe I wouldn't be in this situation at all. They would both have cars, her son would have his own computer to watch all the pornography he wanted and probably show it to my 12 year old son as well...that woould be a fine life, wouldn't it?

No, I think I prefer this outcome...I am paying a little more for 2 wonderful vacations to OZ, wonderland...I promised her nothing but my love and a difficult transition period...

I think she saw the difficulties and deceided to cut and run with whatever she could get...she did not get the $4000.00 funeral money...

RK

RK

Posted by: OzGuyLooking

RK I see your point and I feel for you with what you went through. I also see that you are a fairly strong guy who sees what occured and why. Unfortunately many aren't and don't. Your future will hopefully be brighter for what has occured in the past.

Posted by: nocomfortzone

Quote:

Originally Posted by rk288

Hey NCZ...

I don't know your background or history in relationships with women from the fsu...

Only got history with one. I was not seeking to be in a realtionship with a woman from fsu. She conctacted me and i kept an open mind so it is probably different to many people here as most people from this forum seem to be pursuing woman from fsu and vice versa. So it seems your situation is the same and you were seeking a woman from this region. Personally i think it is a strange way to approach relationships to be looking for a stereotype.

>Of course there were signs of difficulties but these difficulties are pretty >much guaranteed across cultures like this.

So would not that tell you , that means you both have to put in even more effort to make things smoother for each other? Any signs she was approaching this relationship with anything but an extraordinary effort to make you and her feel comfortable i would think is a great warning sign it is likely not to work.

>During my visit I hired a translator to be sure that it was understood that >the only thing I could promise was "difficult" for at least 1, 2 maybe even 3 >years of "new life" in America.

hmmm, i got to admit, that does not seem like a good aproach and was already creating an atmosphere and expectation of difficulty for both of you.
It is one thing to realise there is a real challenge in creating a realtionship when you both have different native languages and cultures but to *promise* difficulties, geez, mate, that is a very pessimisitic picture you pained for both of you. Self fulfulling prophesy in a way.

>Yes, and with the translator we discussed everything. In fact my then >about to be fiancee opened a discussion on how much our meeting was a >holiday and that real life would not be. It was a topic we discussed for at >least an hour wherein I explained many of the obstacles that I perceived to >be in our future if we proceeded...they were all very real...we both >agreed...eyes wide open...yes, hers were

ok, it's great you were both not looking at it with rose coloured glasses like it would be a walk in the park but did you also talk about how could create a wonderful relationship for each other also or was it only a difficult path you were painting for each other.
I'm not hearing a lot of visions and dreams you shared that would make you both excited on your journey you were setting for each other. I got to admit the way i'm hearing it would not inspire me in moments when i had any doubts that the rewards would outway the challenges in a huge manner.

It also sounds like a lot of this serious discussion was only done in an hour, but a mood for an hour is no indication of how a person will be from day to day, month to month and year to year. Maybe you both put too much emphasis on this one meeting and decided to marry based on that mutual acceptance of a difficult path but willing to give it a try.

> and I thought mine were...I >shouold have waited and gone back for a >second meeting...insisted on meeting her friends, her entire family, visiting >her workplace, etc...

Yep! You want to get to know a persons weaknesses and strengths if you intend to spend the rest of your life with them. If you still find you love them unconditionally and have many values in common, then, maybe marriage is a path to consider.

>Imagine, a years worth of correspondence, a file 3 inches thick with letters, >countless photos, thousands of minutes on the telephone...sometimes every >day for 90 minutes or more. Cheap phone cards are wonderful aren't they?

Yes, but it's not what you say or how much you say to each other but more how you relate and feel a genuine deep connection and a clear vision of seeing you sharing a happy future together. You really have not mentioned anything that indicates you both were very passionate and excited for your future together. Sounds more like business partners negotiating over a long time than two people in love with the idea of spendning their lives together.
Maybe i'm missing part of your story where you felt a lot of chemistry you clearly knew was in both directions and was growing stronger.

>And then the actual blissful time of meeting in person...my advice...meet >more than once as many on this forum have advised...much more than once >as the person I flew back with advised...

Yes, i only meet the girl i knew from fsu for about a week and i never had any intention of thinking i would marry her or get engaged whilst i was there even though i genuinely felt a strong connection with her already. I simply went just to get to know her and her environment better and see if i could answer the few things i was unsure of i could not be sure of from e-mails. In fact if i ever seriously imagined marrying her i'd want her to come to my country aswell before we got anywhere near that scenario.

>I guess I was fortunate that I was stung in the way I was. I really believe >she was upset that her plane tickets did not go back thru NYC...I think she >had a connection she was trying to make here...

So clearly you had serious doubts already of what was in her mind and heart. Does not seem like a great connection to base a marriage on. I don't know why anyone would get married when they had any doubts at all.

>Her eyes were wide open on my income but she had no idea about the bills >that come along with such an income and the debt that I had accumulated >to bring them here in such a short time.

like i said, it sounds a lot like you were business partners or a marriage of convenience than a connection at the heart and emotional level.

>As I wrote here before, if I was a multimillionare with huge disposible >discretionary cash maybe I wouldn't be in this situation at all. They would >both have cars, her son would have his own computer to watch all the >pornography he wanted and probably show it to my 12 year old son as >well...that would be a fine life, wouldn't it?

sorry mate, but you sound very pessimisitc and got your heart mixed up with your wallet. I'm sorry you feel bitter. I wish you did not have to expierence any of this. Try not to become a victim of your circumstances. It is past history now. Learn from the expierence and try to base your relationships with what you long in your heart. Don't settle or comprise on any of your values or emotional needs. Life does not need to be hard. Cheer up and watch Life of Brian or Planes Train and Automoblies. It will give you a laugh.
I'm sure you need a good does of this type of medicine.
Things will improve if you expect them to.

Posted by: rk288

Hey, guys, we're hijacking this thread...let's wait and see what NCZ has to say...enough about me...we've been thru it and out of it now...I'm very thankful for you all...your input was very helpful...

Thanks again...now let's see if we can help here...a very interesting intro to a possible situation/issue for me...I hope I can help with some fresh new experience and maybe some seasoned insight...

RK

Posted by: nocomfortzone

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emetsky

Hello folks! I recently had a discussion with a friend of mine who is married to a Ukranian lady.

My friend told me that his wife does not help him in paying for the big bills like rent and utilities. She has a job and she only spends for her own needs (mostly clothing) as well as sending some funds to her family back home. She also has her own Bank accounts. She does not do any cooking or laundering and ironing for him.

She told him that since he brought her to this country, it is his responsibility to take care of her. I believe she is referring to the AOS and "taking care of her means proving everything for free, i.e. food, clothing and shelter plus luxuries. She also told him that if only she had known that he is not able to support her, she would not have come over.

Any comments?

Yeah, revisit the whole idea of why they are together and create a relationship they are both happy to be *partners* in.

Posted by: rk288

Yes, NCZ but what about your friend? We are here to help him aren't we?

Where does he stand now? Legaly, ethically, morally, emotionally? How can this forum help?

RK

Posted by: nocomfortzone

Quote:

Originally Posted by rk288

Yes, NCZ but what about your friend? We are here to help him aren't we?

Where does he stand now? Legaly, ethically, morally, emotionally? How can this forum help?

RK

Personally i could not give a toss about legally. Bugger bringing the legal system into the situation unless there has been a genuine crime committed.
Quite clearly these two people need to sit down have conversations of what they both want and need in a relationship together and find a way of filling each toher needs without comprimising any of their own values. Sadly they should already have discussed these things beforehand but does not souns like they ever did. Can't do nothing about the past now, but they can do something about the present and future. Communication is always the key and it needs to be at their heart level if they are going to make it work for the long term.
I did not understand your question about my friend. Did you mean about the girl i knew from fsu and if so what did you want to know?

Posted by: rk288

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emetsky

My comments are directed to this inquiry from you...you opened the thread about your friend. Let's hear about his news and predicaments. My news is history and of course much more detailed than anyone could ever know here. If you have specific questions of course I will answer. I have been involved with 3 women from the fsu in the past 2 years.

Do you or your friend have any specific questions???

I do not know the laws of your country...only my experiences...

RK

Posted by: OzGuyLooking

RK, you have NCZ and Emetsky mixed up. Emetsky who started the thread, as you have quoted, is not the person who you are now asking questions of.

Posted by: rk288

You are right OZ...sorry to mix things up here...I was busy doing other things in between...busy posts though...

Let's try to get to the subject then...

RK

Posted by: Jim_FL

Out of the tiny tidbit of one-sided information provided, I find this statement most telling & therefore most troubling:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emetsky

She also told him that if only she had known that he is not able to support her, she would not have come over.

I've seen this A LOT over the past few years. The guy goes to FSU and tries to employ US dating stratgies, to win the heart of his Eastern princess, never fully considering the consequences of his words and/or actions. This is further complicated by the favorable exchange rate once abroad - you can live a lot better, for a lot less over there than you can here.

IF the guy misrepresented himself either by accident or on purpose, then the fiancee/wife *may* have a very real and valid complaint. It also *may* go quite far in explaining her other actions with regard to finances. She bet her future on some measure of stability which was in fact, non-existant. She now may find herself in "self preservation" mode, doing what she can to solidify her own future now that she believes he cannot ensure it.

Marital problems of this type CAN be repaired, but it takes an enourmous amount of work from both sides.

Posted by: Spakoyna

I can speak from expierience here. My wife and I had many discussions about money and finances before we were married. Many FSU women believe the money they earn is their money and the money their husband earns is family money. I do not know where this comes from but have seen this same senario in every other WM/FSUW I have associated with. This causes a little thunderstorm occasionally with my wife because I told her under no circumstance would I be in a relationship where everything was not a team effort,housechores,cooking,finances,etc. etc. She sees these other women doing this and questions the issue occasionally. It is usually easy to quell because we have yet to personally witness what we consider a relationship truely built on love(I merely have to point this out). So far they are all plutonic. The most important thing for my wife(and myself) is our relationship together and that we will be together when it's time for the rocking chairs!

Some of the best advice I can give is this: The financial situation is a very important factor in any relationship. This needs to be discussed at length and in depth and fully understood what is expected from both people considering being married. It took me hours of discussion with my wife over several trips to reach a full understanding between each other. It took my wife over a year after we were married to truely settle into our financial plan and understand we need to invest in our future(Just because we have money doesn't mean we need to spend it). Now I am having more trouble convincing her to enjoy a bit of the now(like traveling)!

Posted by: Emetsky

Thanks for all the comments and opinions so far folks.

More...

My friend says that according to his wife, the "sex" that she has provided (and perhaps continues to provide) for him justifies her not having to help with the big bills. She says he should consider himself fortunate that she is working and making her own money otherwise he would also have to pay for her clothes, makeup, shampoo, etc., etc. and provide financial support to her family back home as well.

Is she right or wrong? How about her point with the AOS? According to the document, being her sponsor, he agrees to provide support for her for a certain period of time.

Posted by: Spakoyna

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emetsky

Sounds like he married a prostitute to me.

Posted by: rattlesnake6979

I am having a battle at the moment with my wife - when she lived in the Ukraine what little money she earned was spent on clothes or makeup so its a shock that we have to save for a rainy day. The other fact is that fsu women view foreigners as " rich " or " wealthy ". This translated in my case in her parents coming to stay for 6 months in my house and in them leaving with alot more money than they came with. My wife has never worked and when I suggested work may help us she said that I was presssurising her .
So far all offers of help has been words only from my wife but no action . When I have asked her to get a job this has provoked tears and anger.
In a nutshell any man should be extremely wary of marriage where there is the assumption that one person earns and another spends - this is one sided and is UNREASONABLE BEHAVIOUR. I think women from the fsu think we are soft and they behave accordingly. Money should be discussed during coutship - the bills , the household outgoings -these are issues which need ironing out BEFORE marriage - its too late when you are married to wake up one morning to realise you married someone who couldnt care less whether you work yourself to an early grave .
Oh and in regard to Emetskys question, the lady is saying she is a prostitute as she is saying her husband is paying for sex .

Posted by: swindoom

My wife very wanted to start working and contributing to our household income as soon as she could. She enjoyed being a lady of leisure for a little while but now she enjoys working far more.

Posted by: bingism

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emetsky

Thanks for all the comments and opinions so far folks.

More...

My friend says that according to his wife, the "sex" that she has provided (and perhaps continues to provide) for him justifies her not having to help with the big bills. She says he should consider himself fortunate that she is working and making her own money otherwise he would also have to pay for her clothes, makeup, shampoo, etc., etc. and provide financial support to her family back home as well.

Is she right or wrong? How about her point with the AOS? According to the document, being her sponsor, he agrees to provide support for her for a certain period of time.

What can we say? This is a simple case of someone wanting everything their way - been there, done that, got the T-shirt

As far as I'm concerned everything needs to be divvied up equally. Now, that may not be financial and there are a number of different ways that suit some and not others. Some people are happy with the "traditional" (some might say antiquated) household, where the guy is the bread-winner and the girl is the homemaker. For some it's the other way round and for others everything is shared equally. Whatever makes you happy....

From the evidence presented, I would suggest that this lady would prefer not to do anything for the "family" and rather wants to earn some money to treat herself and every now and then, to "service" her husband. One of the last conversations that I had with Marina before she left was along these lines, i.e. when I get a job my money will be mine and yours will be ours! Even though she turned out to be a fairly unpleasant person, she never once suggested that sex was anything other than mutual, although I do know that she behaved like this with an ex - she openly admitted that she had no love for him other than for his wallet. I'll let you interpret this yourself...

Posted by: That1Guy

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emetsky

My friend says that according to his wife, the "sex" that she has provided (and perhaps continues to provide) for him justifies her not having to help with the big bills. She says he should consider himself fortunate that she is working and making her own money otherwise he would also have to pay for her clothes, makeup, shampoo, etc., etc. and provide financial support to her family back home as well.

Is she right or wrong? How about her point with the AOS? According to the document, being her sponsor, he agrees to provide support for her for a certain period of time.

Overall, it does not sound promising for your friend. "Providing" sex "for him" is a troubling statement for obvious reasons.

However, her statement regarding what she is spending her money on kind of makes sense to me. Afterall, if she were not buying her personal effects, he would be. So, in a sense, she is contributing to the household.

My wife has a couple of bank accounts in Russia (I only learned about them last week), and we did have a discussion about it because when we went to the ATM to check her balances, I showed her how to access the accounts, and when it came time to input her PIN, she made me look the other way. I thought it was strange because that morning, I gave her the password to access our joint checking account online. I have also added her to two credit card accounts, and she already had the credit/debit card that provided full access to our checking and savings accounts. So, for me, it felt like she does not trust me, or thinks I will try to take this money from her (a very unsettling feeling for me). I must say that she only asked to be added to my account before our interview for the expressed purpose of adding more evidence of a legitimate relationship. Since then, she has not mentioned it, and I took it upon myself to do it only about a month ago. I am saying this only because I see a little of the same "What's mine is mine" attitude that is apparent in your friend's relationship, and frankly, I am not sure if it is an issue I should be concerned about or not.

Anyway, I hope things work out for your friend.

Posted by: Jerico

I think its thats the way many of the RW think things should be that their money is their money and you must pay all the bills.
My wife pays for nothing other than gas to drive my jeep to work. This is only recently. She has a decent job and has no bills except a few nordstrom and saks dept cards. Its ok though. If she pays the gas bill I will save 400 a month and honestly i really dont buy her many things. One reason is i am stretched out on the cash flow.I think she still thinks i have some hidden money somewhere ( which I dont ) . She usually buys her own things so its cool with me.
Russian woman can be expensive guys. Know this fact as well as any woman.
Hearing others here maybe it is the norm of RW to have this attitude.
Something to think about for the new guys looking so to speak.
Jerry

Posted by: nocomfortzone

Some crazy ideas i'm hearing here about some RW. Surely if you are in a relationship for life then it is a partnership so whatever income/revenue you both bring in is for the two of you. I can't believe some of you guys would accept this idea that money you bring in is for the both of you and money she brings in is just for her. hmmmm. that's just plain weird thinking. Something you guys should sought out if you are serious about being equals in a relationship. I remember discussing just about ever issue with the girl i meet from Ukraine i don't recall this type of attitude coming up. Whatever you do, do not comprise your values. That would bel ike divorcing a part of yourself to be a relationship with one of these types of woman and it would certainly then not be a 100%-100% relationship. It sounds to me like there is a lot of FSU woman that have some old fashioned ideas more from the 50's in our culture where a realtionship was 50-50 instead of 100-100. This forum sure does amaze me the things i'm learning about some old fashioned ideas still floating around

Posted by: Spakoyna

Quote:

Originally Posted by nocomfortzone

Some crazy ideas i'm hearing here about some RW. Surely if you are in a relationship for life then it is a partnership so whatever income/revenue you both bring in is for the two of you. I can't believe some of you guys would accept this idea that money you bring in is for the both of you and money she brings in is just for her. hmmmm. that's just plain weird thinking. Something you guys should sought out if you are serious about being equals in a relationship. I remember discussing just about ever issue with the girl i meet from Ukraine i don't recall this type of attitude coming up. Whatever you do, do not comprise your values. That would bel ike divorcing a part of yourself to be a relationship with one of these types of woman and it would certainly then not be a 100%-100% relationship. It sounds to me like there is a lot of FSU woman that have some old fashioned ideas more from the 50's in our culture where a realtionship was 50-50 instead of 100-100. This forum sure does amaze me the things i'm learning about some old fashioned ideas still floating around

I bite my toungue as I say this but I gotta say it! The one thing that evolved with my ex-wife and eventually caused the demise of our 24 year marriage was in my opinion the evolution of some women. Suddenly I was expected to give in to the best of both worlds to her. 1st being the old school support the family and 2nd give her all the benifits of the new school woman. Ya can't have your cake and eat it too! It took me 4 years after I asked for a divorce. She knew and I knew if we went to court we would both walk away broke with 2 happy lawyers. Call it middle age crisis or whatever. I realized I was not happy and had become a slave to her desires. She would not give me a divorce in the begining (I suspect because if I left her she could claim the abandonment deal on me). She actually did me a favor! I stopped working my 100+hours a week on 3 different ventures or jobs and scaled down to the only 1 I enjoyed. I stopped doing anything at home and sat on my ass! It took over 2 years after this! She was on easy street and she knew it! She let me off the hook because I reduced my income by 75%! Can't squeeze blood out of a turnip! Never would I enter into a relationship with a woman where she had her money and mine too!

Posted by: nocomfortzone

Geez! 100+ hours per week. That's amazing. You were heading for an early grave at that rate. Good to hear you are atleast getting some of your life back. I guess, better late than never.
You deserve some true happiness after the tough joureny you were on. May you find someone who is truly supportive of you, and you for her, so you are both happy and loving life together.

Posted by: OzGuyLooking

NCZ and Spakoyna, I totally agree with both of you. No way would I go into a relationship that everything was not equal. Money is money, if I earn it se can use it if she earns it I sure as would like to know I could use it, if she said no it is mine then I would cut off mine and she would quickly find herself wondewring why she cant afford what she wants. Spakoyna I have never worked 100 hrs/week but 80-90 have not been uncommon and I agree with NCZ it is a formula for an early grave, that and an unhappy relationship.

As much as I say we need to know and understand our SO's culture and values wealso need to impress upon them ours. This may make me unpopular but to be a couple you must act like a couple and share as a couple. Again NCZ your 100-100 analogy is spot on, my ex only gave 50% while I was giving 100% and she aso thought what was mine was hers and what was hers was hers. If they want to be selfish then let the be but don't get caught up with them.

Posted by: Spakoyna

Quote:

Originally Posted by nocomfortzone

Geez! 100+ hours per week. That's amazing. You were heading for an early grave at that rate. Good to hear you are atleast getting some of your life back. I guess, better late than never.
You deserve some true happiness after the tough joureny you were on. May you find someone who is truly supportive of you, and you for her, so you are both happy and loving life together.

I have found my lovely and happiness and we have been married for over 2 years!!!

Yeap on the 100+ hrs. My ex was into horses. We found the ideal situation...owner financing...had renters in a basement apartment...the ex agreed to start working...ya only live once...take a chance...well 6 months later and with new horse in tow....renters gone...ex not working and yikes! LOOK AT DEM PAYMENTS! All I know is I couldn't sit down and look at TV and have a beer without the Ex bearin down on me for things that needed to be done! I was logging more than 60 hrs a week driven a truck...putting more than 30 hrs a week into my now sucessful bus... and more than the balance into the horses and cows...bushhogging....acre + garden(my idea with no help but was enjoyed by all!) etc. etc.!

Ozguy...I did not set out looking for my wife as some...but perhaps this is why so many are drawn to these wonderful ladies. The main thing is to take the time,spend the time, and make sure they are what you think they are! There are bad apples in every country or culture.

Posted by: nocomfortzone

Quote:

Originally Posted by OzGuyLooking

NCZ and Spakoyna, I totally agree with both of you. No way would I go into a relationship that everything was not equal. Money is money, if I earn it se can use it if she earns it I sure as would like to know I could use it, if she said no it is mine then I would cut off mine and she would quickly find herself wondewring why she cant afford what she wants. Spakoyna I have never worked 100 hrs/week but 80-90 have not been uncommon and I agree with NCZ it is a formula for an early grave, that and an unhappy relationship.

As much as I say we need to know and understand our SO's culture and values wealso need to impress upon them ours. This may make me unpopular but to be a couple you must act like a couple and share as a couple. Again NCZ your 100-100 analogy is spot on, my ex only gave 50% while I was giving 100% and she aso thought what was mine was hers and what was hers was hers. If they want to be selfish then let the be but don't get caught up with them.

Yep! Unfortunately in all cultures there is still a lot of people with the 50-50 attitude. Hence the saying "my other half" still can be heard often. I find it far more inspiring and passionate in a relationship when i know i'm 100% there for my girl, me and the relationship and she has a similar attitude to the relationship we are both partners in.

I do worry when i read some accounts on here the some guys are accepting less than 100% from a partner because they come from a different culture. I'm curious to see how those relationships go over a long period. How many couples , married or otherwise from our two different cultures have been together for close to a decade? It still seems like most i'm reading are still very much in their infancy of a couple of years and some guys are accepting less things from a woman as partner from FSU than they would from their own culture.
A bit of give and take is needed from both partners to create a vision for a life relationship but comprimise on some fundamental values is asking for trouble way down the track when the honeymooning years are over.

Posted by: OzGuyLooking

Quote:

Originally Posted by nocomfortzone

I'm curious to see how those relationships go over a long period. How many couples , married or otherwise from our two different cultures have been together for close to a decade?

I knew I liked you for a reason, you seem to think in similar ways to me. Not sinicle but sure not taking the POV of the most common denominator. I am going to sound like Ham here, but he does have some points so give credit where it is due, what is going to happen in a few years when these ladies who are 10 or more years younger than the guys start to see old men? What is going to happen like in any culture when the love stops or just goes cold?

Quote:

Originally Posted by nocomfortzone

t still seems like most i'm reading are still very much in their infancy of a couple of years and some guys are accepting less things from a woman as partner from FSU than they would from their own culture.
A bit of give and take is needed from both partners to create a vision for a life relationship but comprimise on some fundamental values is asking for trouble way down the track when the honeymooning years are over.

To me it is all about research, get to know the culture, get to know the person you intend to marry, really know as best as you can what their values are, because you don't want to get a nasty suprise later on.

Posted by: That1Guy

Quote:

Originally Posted by nocomfortzone

Hi NCZ,

In my earlier post, I was pretty much exploring my own thoughts on this subject, and maybe you'll admit there is some important information missing. I tend to give the benefit of the doubt before making up my mind. For example, if Emetsky's friend's wife is earning minimum wage, and can only afford to buy a few things, by purchasing her own clothes, and other personal effects, she is helping the household to the extent possible. These are things she will need regardless of who is buying them, so if she wasn't, he would be. I do have difficulty with the rigid posture she has taken - "This is my money - not yours." She should consider how much of "his" money is being used to support her, and realize that it is likely far more than she is contributing. Personally, I would prefer that all the earnings go into a single pot, with both partners understanding that it should be used wisely. (This necessarily requires both people to understand the family finances).

Regarding my own situation, I did take exception to her "hiding" her PINs. As I explained to her, I am not at all interested in her money, and it is NOT that I want to know her PINs. The fact that she feels the need to keep them private is what I find disturbing. It's not a matter of cash - it is one of trust.

She explained to me that it took her many years to save this money, and it is all she has (aside from her apartment in Novosibirsk). She (correctly) points out that she cannot access my retirement or 401(k) accounts. So, maybe it is only fair.

I have seen this privacy/secrecy issue surface in other areas as well (emails, for example - she is very sensitive about this). I can recall reading somewhere (I think on this forum) that Russians can be perceived as being somewhat secretive, and it was suggested that this is kind of a holdover from the Soviet days. I am trying to understand this behavior, because it is not at all like I am. (I could not care less if she reads my emails for example).

Certainly, we discussed many important things (before and after I went to Russia), but I think many will understand that there will still be important issues that will arise in your lives together that will be challenging. At times there will be other aspects of an issue you did discuss that you will discover only after you have decided to committ to a marriage. In other words, it is impossible to consider every aspect of every possible issue that might come up, no matter how careful you might be.

During our discussion, Tatiana mentioned that, "Many women have separate bank accounts." I realize this is true, but I don't necessarily agree with the concept. Maybe if you have millions, this is a necessity, but for what I'll call "ordinary" people, I do not feel it is. The only time I have had a separate account was when (shortly before our divorce) I would find discrpencies, ask about them, and an argument would invariably follow, with my ex.

I certainly do not have all the answers. I know that I am committed to my marriage, and feel very strongly that we will work out whatever problems we encounter. I want to be sensitive to her needs, and I can bend on some issues, but I will not change the core values that make me who I am. I do welcome advice, and it's great to have a place to go for these discussions.

Regarding Emetsky's friend, as I stated earlier, his situation doesn't sound too good to me. However, I do see one similarity in his situation and mine, and I do not know whether or not (or to what extent) this is a problem.

Guy

Posted by: bingism

re. bank accounts

I've always been a big fan of the three account system. Both have one account each plus there's a joint account, into which both pay packets are deposited. Two bank transfers are set up to put relatively equal amounts of "spending" money into each individual account (give or take a little depending on petrol (gas) requirements etc. All household bills come out of the joint account. This method gives both parties equality and autonomy, whilst avoiding the issue of who's contributing what.

Just an idea

Posted by: That1Guy

Hi Bing,

That idea could work for many, and maybe even us - some time in the future. However, we have not had any disagreements about money. We talk about it, and I do a lot of explaining, but we do not disagree about what we should or should not spend money on (thankfully). What hurt my feelings was that I felt she did not trust me (even though she insists that she does). I have yet to formulate a solid argument to explain why she would feel so strongly about keeping these PINs secret. When she asked why I want them, I explained that I do not want them. I know this confused her, but I went on to say that it is not that I want access to this money - it is the fact that she did not want me to have access to it. I immediately made the assumption that she did not trust me. This was very unsettling for me because 1) She can absolutely trust me with her PINs (I have no interest in this money). and 2) I feel she should KNOW she can trust me - that I only have her best interests at heart.

The most logical argument I can up with is that this money represents the sum of all her life's savings, and she is hesitant to give anyone access to it. Couple this with the notion that people from FSU countries have learned to keep certain things private, and we might have a valid reason for this. In saying this, I am trying to understand her reasons - not dictate what they are (I may be way off base).

In any case, it is difficult for me because I am so open about all things, and I did not expect so much concern about privacy and secrecy. After all, when it comes to financial risk, I am much more exposed than she is. (We accept this risk when we complete the affidavit of support).

When I originally posted, I did not intend to change the subject of this thread - I appologize that the focus has somewhat turned to my situation. I posted my own experience to provide some insight from my perspective.

Guy

Posted by: inlove

Quote:

Originally Posted by That1Guy

Regarding my own situation, I did take exception to her "hiding" her PINs. As I explained to her, I am not at all interested in her money, and it is NOT that I want to know her PINs. The fact that she feels the need to keep them private is what I find disturbing. It's not a matter of cash - it is one of trust.

She explained to me that it took her many years to save this money, and it is all she has (aside from her apartment in Novosibirsk). She (correctly) points out that she cannot access my retirement or 401(k) accounts. So, maybe it is only fair.

I have seen this privacy/secrecy issue surface in other areas as well (emails, for example - she is very sensitive about this). I can recall reading somewhere (I think on this forum) that Russians can be perceived as being somewhat secretive, and it was suggested that this is kind of a holdover from the Soviet days. I am trying to understand this behavior, because it is not at all like I am. (I could not care less if she reads my emails for example).

You have to ask yourself why it is bothering you that she wants to keep some parts of her life private.. When two people get married it does not mean they necessarily should abandon all notions of privacy all together. When a letter comes in addressed to your wife, you would not open it, would you? The same thing is with her email correspondence, private diaries, etc. If she wants them to be private, let her keep it private. I think this kind of behavior can be suspicious only when you have reasons to suspect her in something.. Do you?

My fiance and I have been living together for more than an year already, and I still don't know the password to his computer, the same way he does not know mine. We both have separate bank accounts, pins for which are also known to only the account owner, and it does not bother me that I don't know his pin, or have access to his bank account.. We live together and a vast parts of our lives is shared, but it does not mean that we have completely surrunder our privacy..

Quote:

During our discussion, Tatiana mentioned that, "Many women have separate bank accounts." I realize this is true, but I don't necessarily agree with the concept. Maybe if you have millions, this is a necessity, but for what I'll call "ordinary" people, I do not feel it is. The only time I have had a separate account was when (shortly before our divorce) I would find discrpencies, ask about them, and an argument would invariably follow, with my ex.

If you have problem with that, you need to work it out. I think the idea of having 3 accounts, how bingism suggested, is very valuable one. Many couples do it, and in this way you can reach a compromise where both of you feel comfortable with the state of affairs.

Quote:

Regarding Emetsky's friend, as I stated earlier, his situation doesn't sound too good to me. However, I do see one similarity in his situation and mine, and I do not know whether or not (or to what extent) this is a problem.

I'm suspicious of friends coming to the board to voice concerns over their friends' marriages. How the third party sees a situation could be completely different from how people involved in it see it, which in turn could be completely different from what situation actually is. We don't know how financial issues were discussed before the marriage, what his wife actually makes, and what kind of contribution he expects from her. Also, no woman in her right mind will tell her husband that he should pay her because she sleeps with him. The way how the whole issue was presented here seems to be purposely exadurated to me. basically, I don't buy it.

Posted by: That1Guy

Hi Inlove,

Quote:

You are very right! And believe me, I have been pondering this. A friend of mine made a wonderful analogy (that I can only poorly approximate):

When a man and a woman are married it is kind of like those twisted pastries. Although you can see that as the baker worked at combining two separate pieces of dough, he left enough of each individual piece as to be able to distinguish one from the other. The pieces are not easily separated - it would damage both if this were to happen. Yet, each is recognizable as a separate part of the whole.

I definitely agree with this. Each should have their own interests, their own identity as an individual - the relationship takes on its personality from a combination of many aspects of both husband and wife - each bringing what they have to the table. Because we have some common interests, values, and such does not mean we become one person! The relationship is unique only because of the unique qualities that TWO individuals bring to it.

This is partly why I posted this here. (I said earlier, I am still exploring my own thoughts about this).

Guy

Posted by: That1Guy

Quote:

Originally Posted by inlove

Actually, I do not have a problem with separate accounts at all. I cannot overstate that I am not interested in knowing these PINs, or having access to her money. If she had not tried to hide them, (and let's just say I did see them) I would have quickly forgotten them, and there would not have been any problems. (Unless she began to lose sleep over the knowledge of my knowing them). Contrarily, if she did not hide them, and over time, saw I did nothing with them, she might gain more trust in me...in any estimate, a good thing. This situation had the potential to be a very positive trust-building event, and it's kind of sad that it didn't work out that way.

In any case, it is not a huge scandal, and we are still working together. I only wish it could have gone another way.

Posted by: nocomfortzone

Hi That1Guy,
I like your description with the pastry analogy about relationships. I think it is very much how i feel about relationships.

I can see the minor issue with the pins is playing on your mind. The tough situation in trying to discuss this with her is it is easy to get confusing and a misunderstanding take place, especially when she grew up with a different language. Maybe it i simply a case of her sticking strictly to the banking guidelines. Essentially they don't want you giving a pin to someone in your family if your name is only one on that account. Maybe if you were mugged and someone tried to get you to get money out of that account then having the pin numbers allows a dodgy character to get access to the funds in that account. That maybe all it is, i know it's an extreme situation , but her keeping the pins only to herself may having nothing to do with trust and just her following bank guidelines to the letter. I'm sure many loving and trusting couples do this. In general it is a good habit to keep passwords and pins to yourself regardless of whether you trust family and friends.

But what we heard Emetsky's friend's wife attitude about thinking there is her money that has nothing to do with the relationship is a different thing altogether and does not sound like she is fully into the relationship. It does not sound like your partner has that selfish attitude so i would not get too concerned about it.

I also liked Bings idea of 3 accounts. That's seems the most sensible and practical arrangement.

Posted by: nocomfortzone

Quote:

Originally Posted by OzGuyLooking

Well i think everyone has to take responsibility for our own relationships so those factors i assume you go in with full awareness of appearances changing in time and you each had a past part of your life from a different culture. I can only speak for myself but i can't imagine marrying a girl unless i knew beyond any doubt i loved her body, mind, heart and soul and wanted to spend the rest of my life with her. For me there is no out once i'm in, so naturally if i thought there was any possibility of either of us thinking our love could stop then it has not evolved into a relationship where we have a shared vision of being loving life partners with each other. I'm not even religious so for me the only thing that matters to me is that myself and a partner share the same view of a relationship for life as something sacred where we are truly merging our lives together but at the same time not losing our individual uniqueness.

I guess my own opinion of observing many *others* in the world is they get married to someone because they think it is the done thing and just follow rest of society without really exploring what relationships really mean to them for life. People that just follow rest of society like sheep tend to get similar results. Some realtionships as success and some not so. As you said, the most common denominator point of view and they are the types that are more prone to having their love feelings come and go and barely even understand themself deeply so then just merging two lives and keeping the connection close is open to change much more readily and their view of the relationship they got themself into also changing.

I guess i'm just an idealist when it comes to my own views on relationships and i won't comprimise on what i aim for in a life long relationship. It is the most important and exciting thing in life so i think i should treat how i go into a relationship with another as something precious and sacred. Others are free to approach it anyway they like. Life is about our own freedom to choose how we want to live but it does sadden me to see others treat some parts of their life, like relationships so haphardly and only hurting themself in the long run.

Quote:

Yep! Go in with full alertness and awareness. It is the Grand Final of our life so treat it as such and never compromise on seeing it as something very precious each new day.

Posted by: ira156

It all comes down to the relationship you have. My Mother and father were married for over 50 yrs and my Mum took care of all the finances ( thank god ) as my dad was hopeless with money. Most men that give their wives an allowance do it only to weild power. if there is a single income a buget is set and both parties shoul have an allowance.

But the best system is Bings. I lived with a woman for seven years where we both put in a set amount for bills and sundries. The rest of our money was ours in our own accounts. Never had a problem with money in seven years. Of course both parties need to be working for that system.

It once again comes down to communication. Talk about it from the start and lay down the system that you are satisfied with.

Posted by: nocomfortzone

Quote:

Originally Posted by ira156

It all comes down to the relationship you have. My Mother and father were married for over 50 yrs and my Mum took care of all the finances ( thank god ) as my dad was hopeless with money.

he..he.. Same thing in my family. Dad has no idea of good spending habits.
Nowadays you'd hope the partner with the greater wisdom on how to use their money wisely passes on some of that wisdom to the other. I guess that's just how the did it in past generations.
You can always learn something from your partner and vice versa. When two people become set in their ways and certain roles it's going to lead to losing some passion.

Posted by: Andriy Shevchen

Quote:

Originally Posted by nocomfortzone

he..he.. Same thing in my family. Dad has no idea of good spending habits.

Word to the wise... FSU women do not have good spending habits. If you give them credit card they spend like they never had money before. At least the young ones, maybe mature ones too from what I see but I don't date them.

Posted by: OzGuyLooking

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andriy Shevchen

This actually goes against nearly everything most guys here say about their partners.

That1Guy, I dunno the best way for you to deal with what has occured. While in theory the 3 bank account that Bing suggest seems great, to me it divides the partnership/couple.

Inlove, sorry but this is the 1st time I don't agree with you. To me when you are married then you are a couple in a partnership. Secrets that have the ability to be devisive to a relationship (which money invariably will be) are not worth keeping. Having been through a stormy relationship myself where my ex thought she had the right to delve into personal affairs, even when I was 300km away, yet would not answer a simple question for me when I was concerned about her welfare, and believe me there were many concerns by the end, just serve to create a partnership that is uneven in its distribution. It's not about needing to have the knowledge of everything, it is about being open with your partner and NOT keeping secrets.

I am sorry but to me a marriage is an even partnership, if there is a need to keep secrets from your partner then there is a problem but it is not on the behalf of the person who does not know the secret it is on the part of the person who feels the need to keep the secret.

Posted by: swindoom

I agree with OzGuyLooking, a marriage is an even balanced open partnership, why would you keep any secrets from someone you are hopefully spending the rest of your life with.

Posted by: That1Guy

Quote:

Originally Posted by OzGuyLooking

That1Guy, I dunno the best way for you to deal with what has occured. While in theory the 3 bank account that Bing suggest seems great, to me it divides the partnership/couple.

Actually, we haven't had any disagreements regarding money. Having a single bank account seems to be working fine for now. When she begins to work, she may want to open her own account - we have not discussed this yet.

The only reason she told me about these accounts is because she is concerned that the dollar is losing value to the Ruble. (The money is in Dollars). She has read in various forums that the dollar could likely decrease a lot in value in the near future, and wants to do something with the money so that it does not lose value. She does not want to invest in anything that carries substantial risk, so I suggested she put in CDs. Her issue with this is that it would still be in dollars. I told her that speculating on currency carries a great deal of risk because there is no reliable means of predicting what one currency will do against another - there are too many factors that influence movement. I am by no means an investment guru, but I do understand that certain investments carry a greater degree of risk than others. I may be wrong, but I also believe that even if the dollar loses value against the Ruble, it would only become a "real" loss if she went to spend the money in Russia (or buy back Rubles).

I have been trying to get her more interested in day-to-day finances, but she says, "Will it change anything?" To which I respond, "Yes, you will understand our finances, and how much we can afford to spend and to save." But, she is still uninterested in learning the details.

Anyway, it is not the money that is the issue (at least for me).

Posted by: inlove

Quote:

Originally Posted by OzGuyLooking

Inlove, sorry but this is the 1st time I don't agree with you. To me when you are married then you are a couple in a partnership. Secrets that have the ability to be devisive to a relationship (which money invariably will be) are not worth keeping. Having been through a stormy relationship myself where my ex thought she had the right to delve into personal affairs, even when I was 300km away, yet would not answer a simple question for me when I was concerned about her welfare, and believe me there were many concerns by the end, just serve to create a partnership that is uneven in its distribution. It's not about needing to have the knowledge of everything, it is about being open with your partner and NOT keeping secrets.

I am sorry but to me a marriage is an even partnership, if there is a need to keep secrets from your partner then there is a problem but it is not on the behalf of the person who does not know the secret it is on the part of the person who feels the need to keep the secret.

Oz, it is fine that you disagree with me. There are different views on how family financial affairs should be conducted, and on how privacy issues should be approached. Ther most important thing is to be on one page with your partner about it. So, in our family there is no need to disclose pins or each other email passwords because we trust each other without it. I'm not going to hide my pin/password from my fiance on purpose, but he is never going to ask for it because he does not feel any need to know it.
He is not going to open my mail because he does not need to do it. If he did, then we would have had a big problem on both sides.. If people genuinly love and trust each other, and these love and trust have never been violated, they don't have a need to know "each other secrets", simply because there is no secrets to know..Whatever needs to be disclosed, gets disclosed volunterily without invasion of privacy.

Posted by: inlove

Quote:

Originally Posted by That1Guy

The only reason she told me about these accounts is because she is concerned that the dollar is losing value to the Ruble. (The money is in Dollars). She has read in various forums that the dollar could likely decrease a lot in value in the near future, and wants to do something with the money so that it does not lose value. She does not want to invest in anything that carries substantial risk, so I suggested she put in CDs. Her issue with this is that it would still be in dollars. I told her that speculating on currency carries a great deal of risk because there is no reliable means of predicting what one currency will do against another - there are too many factors that influence movement. I am by no means an investment guru, but I do understand that certain investments carry a greater degree of risk than others. I may be wrong, but I also believe that even if the dollar loses value against the Ruble, it would only become a "real" loss if she went to spend the money in Russia (or buy back Rubles).

Actually, the dollar has increase its value against the ruble since last summer. All predictions that it should rise even more, although not substantially. Anyway, the values are pretty stable for a long run, so she can relax about her savings for now.

Posted by: OzGuyLooking

Inlove, I appreciate your reply, I did not see that in your other post but I can see what you mean. It is funny you mention mail and email, my ex actually hacked into my email account to read my personal correspondances and open my personal mail and then kept my mail from me for over a month. When such things happen there is no trust and therefor there is no relationship.

Again I appreciate your reply.

Posted by: PacificFleet009

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emetsky

She is not sounding too different from your run of the mill American female. I really think that women the world over are pretty much the same. They seem to love your wallet but not you.

Posted by: bobjf

Quote:

Originally Posted by ira156

It all comes down to the relationship you have. My Mother and father were married for over 50 yrs and my Mum took care of all the finances ( thank god ) as my dad was hopeless with money. Most men that give their wives an allowance do it only to weild power. if there is a single income a buget is set and both parties shoul have an allowance.

But the best system is Bings. I lived with a woman for seven years where we both put in a set amount for bills and sundries. The rest of our money was ours in our own accounts. Never had a problem with money in seven years. Of course both parties need to be working for that system.

It once again comes down to communication. Talk about it from the start and lay down the system that you are satisfied with.

mate i had opposite problem with an x that could not be trusted with money & to some extent i'm still paying for her excess's even now.
natasha on ther hand is extremly astute with our money & most times knows what is available for use without needing to check.
we have a joint account but she still likes me to give her pocket money each week,it has caused the odd drama when i have forgotten & just say use your card.
point is to her its not the same & this small cash stash of hers she uses for little supprises for me without me knowing about it.
very nice feeling for me.
my lady is far from materialistic
but the kichen & garden are another matter lol

Posted by: Seaview

Quote:

Originally Posted by PacificFleet009

She is not sounding too different from your run of the mill American female. I really think that women the world over are pretty much the same. They seem to love your wallet but not you.

Only if there is nothing to love in you. In this case your wallet is a last resort to respect you, at least.