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Very intense now...

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Posted by: rk288

Ok,

We are married now a little while (since May 6th)...

Shortly after the marriage my wife's mother suffers a stroke which paralyzes her and sends her to the hospital. I send money right away...and then more...and more...I borrowed money for this...

I wrote the US Embassy but they refer me to the Ukrainian Embassy in Washington as they have no way to check this situation for a Ukrainian citizen...

Anyone know how to find out what the medical details are over there? At the very least I may need information for tax purposes...

My wife is cold to me now and frequently angry about money. With visas, airline tickets, greencard applications, wedding, clothes and now emergency medical bills we now live week to week on my income...

What do you think???

RK


Posted by: Pin Boy

rk welcome and sorry to hear about this situation. i don't know if it's possible for any embassy to be helpful in this situation. what do you expect them to be able to do for you? not even sure this would qualify for any type of tax deduction but i'm no expert.

mind if i ask how long you knew you're wife before you married? how many times did you visit? could it be that this is a con to get money and mom is in perfect health? something to consider.

on the other hand, your wife may not be mad at you but mad that she cannot travel at this time to be with her mother.

maybe some more details will help you get some more advice.

good luck

pin boy


Posted by: EasyTarget

Well if you did have receipts (and I am guessing you don't) if the medical expenses exceeded 7.5% of you adjusted gross income the medical expenses would be tax deductible.

The surefire deduction is that of a gift deduction, up to 10,000. Keep receipts of the Western Union transfers, or however you transfered the money.

Don't jump on the scam band wagon too quick...Just think about how you would feel if you were thousands of miles away from you mum and there was nothing you could do to help her out.

Possible way to check up on the mum is to hire a private detective, sounds really odd but they could easily go to the hospital / house and inquire about her health.


Posted by: firemansam

Feel free to shoot me if I am wrong..... (like you wouldn't!!!)

But I am sure I read somewhere that for native Ukranians, their medical costs were covered by the government and this is part of the reason why tourists have to pay for "compulsorary" (sp?) medical insurance, over and beyond what they would have on their normal travel insurance.

So "IF" I am correct (big if!), maybe this is a dodgy call for funds for mum? Like I said though, I am by no means an expert on this and there are many others that would be better informed than myself......

Curious myself now....
Sam.


Posted by: Texas Proud

It does sound dodgy to me also... I thought that they had socolized medicine...

But, I do know that my GF paid to have vericous veins removed from her leg in Russia.. and she said it does cost for certain things.... so who knows???

Also, Easytarget was mistaken... there is not 'deduction' for gifts.. you can give gifts free of 'gift taxes' up to $12,000 per year... but you can not deduct anything..


Posted by: Spakoyna

Wow,Sticky situation. If I understand correctly her mother does have health care. The problem is what quality of healthcare.

My wife's family has had to spend big bucks on healthcare in the past(10-20 years ago). Her brother had to have an operation to save his life which the government health system would not cover. Her mother also had a problem with her heart. The government health system basically told her she would have to rest abd take it easy the rest of her life(From what I understand was a very short time). My wife ran herslef ragged, researching doctors, etc. She found a doctor and clinic which could help. They had to pay for this but they saved her mother's life.

I do not know what to do in your situation to determine if her claims are genuine. I will tell you this it will become a deal breaker between you and your wife if you openly show her you do not trust her. You nead to tread very lightly here. Perhaps you could find someone who speaks Russian who could help you do a little detective work on the telephone. I am certain there has to be a way to find out discretely. Why not send her flowers and have a picture taken? I do not know how the reaction would be but if delivered it should satisfy beyond a shadow of a doubt!


Posted by: waiting123

correct...no deduction for gifting monies. The benefit is the person receivingthe 12k does not have to pay taxes on it.... That is the benefit.

Also the 7.5% of AGI is correct, but I do not believe you can write off medical expenses to another country for your mother in law. I believe the law is clear, it has to be someone under your domain of support....If your MIL lived with you it would be ok.but she does not fall under your support... You need to double check this with your CPA... Texas proud maybe able to answer this for us.

This is a very sticky area... I am not sure what to say... I think Spakoyna said it best!!!


Good luck to you!


Posted by: Pin Boy

when i was last in odessa three years ago, it was explained to me that in the current climate a patient is given a hospital room, access to the doctors and basically nothing else. a woman told me that the family must provide medications, bandages, and food. the patients are basically on their own.

two experiences i had. on my first visit, i met a girl from kherson with whom i had been corresponding. she met me in odessa. i was not interested in her as a partner but did call her after i returned to the states to say hello and see how she was. when she answered she immediately cried out that her mother "hurt her hands" and could not make clothes which she did as the sole provider for the family. i was skeptical. said i was sorry that happened. wished her luck. as i said, there was no relationship so i did not feel obligated in any way. also this girl had told me about a month before i arrived that she had been robbed and her cell phone stolen. when we were walking around odessa she kind of hinted how hard it would be for her to replace the phone, which is true, but i got the sense she brought it up to see if i'd buy her one, which i didn't

second incident: on my first trip to ukraine i met a girl and went back and visited her two more times. the second visit went well, the third something fishy was going on and i got the sense i was being lied to and the woman wanted to use me for money. the interpreter from my first trip also was with us for a good bit of time on each of my trips and she confirmed my suspicions. long story there for another time. but after my third trip my ex-GF called from odessa and said her mother had "leg problems" and needed $600 for treatment. i was skeptical of her already and this was just the topper. when i asked for more specifics on her condition, treatment, etc., i was told i was stingy and she could never be with such a man. an excuse to break it off after she knew i was onto her.

so i hope this is not your case, but as the others said, i'd check it out for sure before i would go any further and yes, tread lightly!

good luck

pin boy


Posted by: Jill

Quote:
it was explained to me that in the current climate a patient is given a hospital room access to the doctors and basically nothing else. a woman told me that the family must provide medications, bandages, and food. the patients are basically on their own.



This is correct. When I went to the doctor in Ukraine I even had to provide my own rubber gloves! On top of that you almost always have to pay bribes to doctors for decent care (as well as various gifts afterwards). And that is is the state run clinics. A private clinic (which is generally considered much better) can be quite expensive and you must pay for everything.


Posted by: skinsfan

when i was last in Russia, my father in law had to go in the hospital because of a heart condition...we brought him food daily and even purchased certain medications for him at the doctors request...it is different over there, and extra cash can get you better care as well as a better room...money speaks volumes in the FSU.


Posted by: rk288

Thank You as usual you are very helpful.

Today was my day off and a good day in the morning for us. I helped her loose to the chess computer and she chased me around the house laughing. She's still a bit cold to me now though...

In the afternoon my wife was on the computer talking by internet and then many hours privately on the phone. My Russian is not that good but everything was very serious and intense about her Mother. Things have apparently taken a turn for the worse or at least they are not improving.

I still wish there was an easy way to obtain a report of some kind...I am a medical professional and I could make an assesment...what that would be for a 74 year old stroke victim I don't know...not very positive from my own experience...I know about the "extra expenses" on top of socialized medicine in Ukraine...

At any rate here's some more info...

Last Friday we sat on the porch together and my wife began to explain something to me. She said that her Mother had never been ill a day in her life and that she had talked to her about her illness. She explained to her daughter that she is ill because my wife does not go to the Church of her parents, grand parents and their parents. She also told her that she can only begin to recover from this illness if my wife does not go to Church with me and my son...this is not good...

My wife explained to me again about the Christian Orthodox Church and how our Chruch was so very different and so much not like Church...I tried to explain to her that "where ever 2 people are gathered in Jesus' name He is also there"...all Churches are God's houses...when you are there He is there with you...

My wife is "distancing" herself from me in many ways since our marriage...there are no more hugs and kisses...she sleeps on her side of the bed and I on mine...there is not much warmth...

My wife and her son however watch much television all day and laugh and joke together often. When I ask what they are talking about??? They say "nothing"...

These of course are not all of the details...Father's Day was very difficult because of my ex-wife and at that time my wife's Mother was still in the hospital...many misunderstandings...

It is such a young marriage for so many difficult circumstances all at once...the Green Card interview is August 3rd...I have offered that my wife could return to Ukraine to care for her Mother...in fact after the Father's Day nightmare I suggested she return...she does not understand the circumstances of divorce and visitation in America...my ex-wife of 6 years is of course very happy to cause problems...

Unsure of my position...

RK


Posted by: waiting123

Quote:
Originally Posted by rk288
Thank You as usual you are very helpful.

Today was my day off and a good day in the morning for us. I helped her loose to the chess computer and she chased me around the house laughing. She's still a bit cold to me now though...

In the afternoon my wife was on the computer talking by internet and then many hours privately on the phone. My Russian is not that good but everything was very serious and intense about her Mother. Things have apparently taken a turn for the worse or at least they are not improving.

I still wish there was an easy way to obtain a report of some kind...I am a medical professional and I could make an assesment...what that would be for a 74 year old stroke victim I don't know...not very positive from my own experience...I know about the "extra expenses" on top of socialized medicine in Ukraine...

At any rate here's some more info...

Last Friday we sat on the porch together and my wife began to explain something to me. She said that her Mother had never been ill a day in her life and that she had talked to her about her illness. She explained to her daughter that she is ill because my wife does not go to the Church of her parents, grand parents and their parents. She also told her that she can only begin to recover from this illness if my wife does not go to Church with me and my son...this is not good...

My wife explained to me again about the Christian Orthodox Church and how our Chruch was so very different and so much not like Church...I tried to explain to her that "where ever 2 people are gathered in Jesus' name He is also there"...all Churches are God's houses...when you are there He is there with you...

My wife is "distancing" herself from me in many ways since our marriage...there are no more hugs and kisses...she sleeps on her side of the bed and I on mine...there is not much warmth...

My wife and her son however watch much television all day and laugh and joke together often. When I ask what they are talking about??? They say "nothing"...

These of course are not all of the details...Father's Day was very difficult because of my ex-wife and at that time my wife's Mother was still in the hospital...many misunderstandings...

It is such a young marriage for so many difficult circumstances all at once...the Green Card interview is August 3rd...I have offered that my wife could return to Ukraine to care for her Mother...in fact after the Father's Day nightmare I suggested she return...she does not understand the circumstances of divorce and visitation in America...my ex-wife of 6 years is of course very happy to cause problems...

Unsure of my position...

RK


I am very sorry to hear about your situation.... maybe you can PM Ms. Smarty Pants and she can help lend you some advice. She is a Russian lady here who contributes often... How well does your wife speak english? I only ask because maybe she feels flustered and does not know the right words...or maybe she would feel more comfortable talking Russian to another adult.

I am truly sorry.. I really hope there is a chance for you two... but what the mother said is very damaging to your relationship... I do not like divorce... and yes I have an ex wife.... and I hate to see people go through it....especially after going through time and expense of what you have gone throuh.

Has this coldness started since her mother had her stroke or was it before? Do you think it might help her to go home and spend time with her mother... and then when she returns all will be ok?

I hate to think she is just after a green card.. I always try and see the best in all people. I do not like to label people as a scammer or any other name.... I hope you can find out more... where in Ukraine by the way. My wife has a very close cousin that lives in Ukraine. Zaporozhye...


Posted by: Jerico

Quote:
...my ex-wife of 6 years is of course very happy to cause problems...

Ya they are good at that aren`t they?
Dont you know your never supposed to be happy after she divorces you? Your supposed to stil be upset that she left you. Hehhe

Sorry to hear about your problems RK288 .
You know Russians can be very superstitious people let me tell you.
I laugh at some of the things my wife says.To us they are stupid and to them they are not. I especially love the (DONT WHISTLE ONE).
So maybe this church thing to her is very real.
Jerry


Posted by: rk288

Well, more details then...

On top of everthing else, her son's only interest is computers...nothing else...

Yesterday for the fifth time I found addresses of pornographic sites on the family computer. I have discussed this privately with him 4 times previously. These sites infect computers. This computer was clean when they arrived here. Since their arrival it has been attacked numerous times from these inappropriate sites. He is 19 years old.

The last time I told him again privately that if it happens again I will discuss it with his Mother. So, last night I wrote her a letter in Russian about the incident saying only that "bad" things are on the computer.

He has always in the past denied any wrong doing, saying "it is not me" until I pull up the record and show him the site, date and time. Only then does he admit to it, promises never to do it again and then tries to find a new way to hide the trespass...

I worked 12 hours today and when I came home the lights were all off and my wife and step son were watching TV. I said hello...Maks said hello, Mila said nothing...

Mila later came into the office and confronted me sternly regarding the computer which I had disabled saying that Maks only uses it for music and painting...he is spoiled by her???

I asked her if she had discussed my letter with Maks. She said she had and he had told her he had done no wrong...she did not know anything about the pornographic sites...he did not tell her anything...I am the "bad guy"...

I finally did tell Mila that this is a family computer, important for banking, investments and other family business only. This has been my emphasis to Maks every time I have found intrusions from inappropriate sites.

Mila went to discuss this with Maks, it was brief then I heard some comotion upstairs and I waited for things to be calm.

I went upstairs to find Mila in bed reading apparently an address book and another book called "Women's Orange" which she quickly threw on the floor on the other side of the bed...

She began to confront me about the computer incident and how again now for the endlesseth time she and Maks are in prison here waiting for green cards.

"why do you bring a woman from a big city to the country???" "You break my life and the life of my son"...and on and on again and again I hear this same complaint...

I try to explain that we must wait for green cards...all the while now her Mother is ill and getting worse...

During my visit to Mila in Ukraine I hired an interpreter and I explained that it would be very difficult for us all for probably 1, 2 or 3 years. I have repeatedly explained that I am not a wealthy man and now with her Mother's illness it is even more difficult...I have explained that I have an obligation to my own son also...she often apparently scoffs at this obligation which I find very offensive but I have not told her so...

Our communications prior to their arrival here were all very positive and accepting to the "known" difficulties we were about to undertake with "love and understanding"...ever since the arrival there has been anger from her about understanding...

They both refuse to speak English even though Maks studied English for 11 years in Ukraine and frequently, almost rudely corrects his Mother's pronunciation and choice of words...

I am frequently confronted with "you do not want to understand me..."

I am up against a wall here...I beat my head against it only because it feels good when I stop...

I sit and listen to Russian complaints about me...I nod..."yes, I understand"...I listen some more, and then more...I nod again..."yes, I am sorry"...

I am sorry we have to wait for green cards...I am sorry your Mother is ill...I am sorry I am not a wealthy American...

shto tvie khoshesh ot menya???


Posted by: Cheburashka

I think she is waiting for her green card and then she will kick you to the curb. I know this is not what you want to hear. But it is my opinion, and I have a bad feeling about this situation. I wonder what would happen if you told her to go back home and spend some time really getting her thoughts together about wanting to be with you.

Relationships are like a garden: it is amazing how fast the weeds spring up if we let one or two go. Tell her honestly how you feel.

And get some software like Cyber Patrol or Net Nanny on the computer to block those sites. See what that does. It'll let lots of "music and painting sites" through but will stop the porn.


Posted by: skinsfan

rk288.....i can only respond based on what information you give, and based on my experience with my wife and children.....it sounds to me as if she has no respect for you.....their cannot be love without respect...she has appeared to waste no time in creating distance emotionally between the two of you...be careful...you know what your gut feeling is, or you would have never posted your concern........do not let that green card arrive for her, and she takes you to the cleaners......again, this opinion is based solely on what you are posting....just be careful !!


Posted by: waiting123

Quote:
Originally Posted by skinsfan
rk288.....i can only respond based on what information you give, and based on my experience with my wife and children.....it sounds to me as if she has no respect for you.....their cannot be love without respect...she has appeared to waste no time in creating distance emotionally between the two of you...be careful...you know what your gut feeling is, or you would have never posted your concern........do not let that green card arrive for her, and she takes you to the cleaners......again, this opinion is based solely on what you are posting....just be careful !!


I agree with this after I read your last post.... I would tell her your honest feelings. If she does not want to listen, walks away or just don't care, then that shows you the effort she wants to put into the marriage and your relationship. I think you need to tell her that it is better for her to go back to Russia and put some thought into what she wants...from you and from this marriage...

Sorry rk288.... the only other thing to do is think about seeking some counseling....maybe there is an underlying cause to what is happening... Remeber there is always 2 sides to every story. You mentioned in your post she said she feels like she is in a prision.. why does she say this??

just my 2 cents here.....


Posted by: rk288

Obviously, I have simlar feelings about the greencard thing...I wonder what the legal and immigration details are about these thoughts? The greencard interview is August 3rd...

Oh, and her son is a whiz...he's 10 times faster than I am on my own computer and I have been computer literate since the early 70's. He will simply go into the registry and get around any program I put in his way. He gets his own way all the time...he is very helpful to me though and this is the only sign of disrespect or unwillingness to cooperate that I have run up against.

Other things...when we were planning the marriage some strange questions were asked; like "what if I move to another state, will my name still be the same" and a question about divorce which I don't remember...


Posted by: skinsfan

make an infopass appointment alone and speak to them about this problem..also maybe you can contact your senator and speak to their aides in immigration .... speak to a lawyer about no fault divorce....this is only what comes to mind...i have never done this before.....i also think that if you do not appear at the aos appointment that your case will be considered closed...but no matter what you do....do something, and soon....good luck


Posted by: Spakoyna

After reading the rest of your posts I must agree to be careful! If it is truely as your writing suggests I would expect the worst. If you do decide to end the realationship watch out for the abuse scam. Many women are very familiar with the proceedings and can take you to the cleaners if they are successful! I am so sorry for you if it is truely as you describe. Wishing the best for you.


Posted by: searcher

I'll have to agree with Steve (Cheburashka) about Net Nanny or Cyber Patrol.

As for the green card, I have a different theory...

I think many such women think that because our incomes are much greater that we must also have much greater disposable income but this is not true and many do not understand life here.

Think of it this way, she probably thinks bill and debts are the same as in Ukraine. If she had to pay cash for everything, rarely used credit (if she ever used it at all) and mos of her income was disposable or even if she was just able to survive a Westerner's income looks amazingly huge!

Just think of it this way... maybe she made $50-100 per month, that would be $600-1200 per year and if she could eat, pay her bills (rent, maybe the telephone, other utilities) she probablt thinks YOUR expenses are/were the same. It is/was probably a BIG shock to her to see that you pay so much for rent or a mortgage, etc.

Even a person with an income of $20,000 per year would seem "rich" in Ukraine but here that is just above the poverty level.

She may have said she understood you were not rich... however, "Rich" is a relative term... for some it could mean that you mean you are not a millionare but to someone that makes even $4000 per year, if you made $30,000 per year, YOU ARE RICH - relatively speaking.

So, she may not understand why you can not spend more of you income (which she may assume is largely disposable) for her mother or other things she wants.

Yes, if she doesn't know the reality of life here and her "golden dreams" didn't come true, then she may leave... green card or no green card.

If she thinks she may have a better life here or better opportunities, she may wait for the green card and possible look for someone she thinks will provide her a life of "golden dreams".....

I hope things work out for you but she needs to understand some things and no one can make her understand... She could also be having problems adjusting or "culture shock"... I don't know but I still wish for the best for you!


Posted by: Spakoyna

Searcher,
I could believe what you say maybe 10 years ago. But! These women are more informed than you seem to realize. My wife was told in probably 2002 by her agency that the man she was corresponding with making 60K a year was inadequate! She has learned better since but these women do know more about finances as a whole than you imply! I have heard that many Ukrainian women do not understand the concept of a credit card...but 1 bill and paying the balance should clarify this!


Posted by: Pin Boy

yes spakoyna, but then they understand that and pay that credit card bill after they have been here for a while. in between i would say the majority of women who consider a mate outside the FSU have very little understanding of the expenses/income issue. yes, more do than ten years ago due to the proliferation of the internet and cable/satellite TV, but i'd guess there is a steep learning curve. a ukrainian woman i was speaking with last week who has been in the country for 4 years remarked how fast money goes in the states. it was an eye opener for her. i can't imagine many of these women researching or spending much time thinking about 401 k's, roth ira's, CD's, mutual funds, credit cards, taxes, fees and the variety of mortgage products.

pin boy


Posted by: rk288

I did write a letter in Rusian tonight expressing my feelings that she should return to Ukraine to care for her Mother...

She and her son sit and watch television talking and laughing together...I sit on the porch alone waiting...nothing has been said to me for many hours now and this is the first night amidst all of this trouble that there was not a "family" meal together...they have been at the television all night...no response to my letter...


Posted by: waiting123

Quote:
Originally Posted by rk288
I did write a letter in Rusian tonight expressing my feelings that she should return to Ukraine to care for her Mother...

She and her son sit and watch television talking and laughing together...I sit on the porch alone waiting...nothing has been said to me for many hours now and this is the first night amidst all of this trouble that there was not a "family" meal together...they have been at the television all night...no response to my letter...


man I am at a lose of what to write.... I really am. I hope all works out for the best... which ever direction you have to go.


Posted by: searcher

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spakoyna
Searcher,
I could believe what you say maybe 10 years ago. But! These women are more informed than you seem to realize. My wife was told in probably 2002 by her agency that the man she was corresponding with making 60K a year was inadequate! She has learned better since but these women do know more about finances as a whole than you imply! I have heard that many Ukrainian women do not understand the concept of a credit card...but 1 bill and paying the balance should clarify this!


I agree that they are informed but there is a difference between being informed and understanding!!!!!!!

We may be informed about many things in the former Soviet Union, however we never experienced those things and there are perhaps some things which are lost upon us because we never experienced them, while we may be informed about them.

They may not understand the dynamics of everything here until they experience it first hand and still $60K/year sounds like a lot to someone that earned substantially less.


Posted by: bobjf

Quote:
Originally Posted by rk288
I did write a letter in Rusian tonight expressing my feelings that she should return to Ukraine to care for her Mother...

She and her son sit and watch television talking and laughing together...I sit on the porch alone waiting...nothing has been said to me for many hours now and this is the first night amidst all of this trouble that there was not a "family" meal together...they have been at the television all night...no response to my letter...


rk mate i feel very sorry for you,it would appear from what you write that the only 1 interested in the marriage is you.
unfortunately i tend to agree with cheb.
mate i think i would say ok go home & look after your mother & while your there evaluate your feelings because you are destroying us.
did her coldness to you begin befor mother incident.
i feel you are being taken for a ride which could end up very expensive for you if you don't something quick.

sit down with her & ask her straight out what the go is,why are you treating me like this,if it dosen't cease the marriage will over very soon & why do you choose to beleive your son is so inocent when i can show you what he does.

i had simular prob with my step daughter who managed to infect my pc so often we have now banned her completly unless it is for school work & then only under supervision (she is 16 & while not into bad stuff she uses all sorts of russian programs & music programs)
computer is on ep pro & is password protected lol you should be able to come up with something he won't work out.
there is no point useing porn blockers if he is just going to turn them off.

ps i had the very good pc anti virus & firewall control but she used to turn them off because they didn't allow some of her crap


Posted by: searcher

Not a slam on PC but just an FYI....

The Macintosh (which I use) has built-in parental controls. However (I learned the hard way) do not allow them to put their bookmarks in a folder in the desktop (on the Mac). That is how can by passed the restricted sites. They try to go there, get a message it is blocked and drag the link to the folder, when they click on the link in the folder, it takes them to the site.

I hope that is fixed at some point... maybe it is now since there have been 2 OS updates since I tried that.


Posted by: vic2012

Hi RK

I think many respondents here have experienced what you are going through.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rk288
My wife is "distancing" herself from me in many ways since our marriage...there are no more hugs and kisses...she sleeps on her side of the bed and I on mine...there is not much warmth...

But after two months marriage?

Usually you start on a high when you marry (unless you've lived together for period before) and things settle down. But if this is the level after two months.......it sounds heartbreaking.

I posted on another thread today that, I believe in love and in a heart based relationship. I think you really have to ask yourself, if love, in your relationship, still really exists (especially from her). Without love you are just flatmates.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rk288
Unsure of my position...
And this makes matters worse.

I know the mother problem is a major distraction, but in adversity you should be closer together.

One small point. You are a Virgo and a small downside for Virgos is:
Fussy and a worrier
Overcritical and harsh
Perfectionist and conservative
and meticulous

So, without wishing to make light of this serious situation, if this does describe you, to some extent; it's possible she needs you to lighten up a bit.


Posted by: Pin Boy

vic, this is a first for me! you are the first man i have ever witnessed demonstrate any credence in astrology!!! aye carumba!

not to get away from the poor guy's situation, but i never thought i'd live to see this day.....oh, we are doomed!! doomed i say!!!

back to the thread, but this man doesn't say where they live but it sounds like a rural area from one of her comments. maybe she needs to have more things to do if the relationship can be salvaged. sounds like she's isolated. wonder what she does during the day and how much social contact they have????

pin boy


Posted by: vic2012

Oh dont get me wrong. I dont really put much credence in astrology.

But...........there's something in it. You might have noticed the dying embers of a posting from my fan club regarding my birthday; which makes me a Cancer. And WOW, am I a cancer. Home loving, requiring domestic stability, sensitive and possessive of relationships and possessions.

So what can say?
Cross my palm with a silver Pin Boy


Posted by: Cheburashka

If your step son is such a wiz in getting around parental control software, fight fire with fire. Get some "ghosting" software that logs every key stroke, or mirrors it to another pc. That'll teach him.

Now I have to be an a$$. Sorry! You are sitting out on the porch while they watch TV and ignore you????? March in there, turn off the damn TV, and say we need to talk! I'm not going to put up with this, and what can we do to change. Desperate times call for desperate measures. If you love your family, fight for it. Tell her to communicate or get the hell back home. You be the man! If she is setting you up (and I think she is) she will be a little more hesitant if she sees some chutspa in you. It's time to flex some muscle! She's disrespecting you, and you are taking it. (?????) Nobody..I mean NOBODY deserves to be disrespected like that. Put on "Back In The USSR" on the stereo, and have a family chat.

We have faith in you! And you don't deserve to be a victim. Feed off of the strength of the outstanding men in this forum. Quit posting and start some action before it's too late.

Luv ya dude! We wish you the best.


Posted by: myshka

Not a slam on RK88 but am I the only one on this forum who wonders why a man who is living with his woman and her son and in order to get his points across he writes a letter in Russian? Don't you guys talk? Why are you writing letters?

I am sorry but I think this is indicative of the problems in the relationships of people not prepared to be married. If you cant communicate on even a basic level to let your wife know how bad you feel about how she is treating you, something is wrong.

On a lighter note, my husband is a computer professional, and there was a time when my son was surfing porn instead of getting out looking for a job during the day. So without saying anything, my husband fixed it so that whenever my son wrote in words or got to a website that had XXX words in it, it directed the browser automatically to a work search site!!! Boy did it piss off the boy!!!! But it did get a point across.


Posted by: Texas Proud

First... writing down your concerns and letting them read is not as bad as it sounds... a woman at work said she has never had an 'argument' with her husband in 20 years of marriage... they disagree, but she said they write a letter for the other... it takes time and you can put all of your thoughts down without getting interuppted... the other one HAS to get all you want to say as it is in writing... and the other would respond by changing or a letter back... we thought it was nuts at first, but she swears it works just fine...

BUT... and a big BUT... I do not think this is the problem with this lady.. I think there is no love there... she wanted to get out of Russia and she did... at least from HIS side it is that way.. all she wants is a green card...

I will tell you my GF says that her family is FIRST, but she would like to be able to do other things which might include working... your wife has it backwards..

Time to admit it was a mistake and fix it...


Posted by: Jutman

Try to imagine what this women is going trough.

1) her moms in a hospital. There seems a lack of of understanding whats is the condition. Severall sickness can be the same as a dead sentence in FSU.

2) She is not home to help !!!

3) Does the son know ?? I am not sure, he has all the info. Just grandmom is at hospital, so the mom has pressure at her.

4) Sure, its not funny to ask your new husband for help, but if its the only way.

5) Because of the papers are in progressiv, she donøt know if she is sold/bougfth for America.

6) The 4/ situation does she can't work and make money. She is 100% depended at the husband = prisoner.

so all these worries make you abosolutely not in mood for kiss, hugging and intimacy.

So if you stand by her side, during this rougth time (and its her, who need your support) you will get a faithful, loving wife for teh rest of your life.


Posted by: Traveler

I have to agree 100% with Cheburaska! You need to be assertive, and find out exactly what the truth of the situation is. You may have to take measures that seem extreme to you - but ultimately everyone will be very happy that you did so - unless they are lying. Talk to each of them together and separately, too. Speak your mind assertively, and perhaps lay down some ground rules with consequences, you will earn some new repect.

But one piece of personal advice - don't try to "fix". Just get some honest dialogue going by whatever means necessary - even if it is heated or confrontational. Listen and keep them talking. Let them offer the solutions - prompt them where necessary. Even if you think you know "the perfect solution" to every issue raised, choke it back and let/make them talk!

I hate to say it, but it sounds as if you are already in a loveless marriage - and the wife is working to keep the son on her side. There are problems and they still need you - time for you to STEP UP.


Posted by: rk288

Hello again...

I hope to make some sense out of this...

The Green Card interview was 8/3. We arrived early with an interpreter and we were taken in early. The officer reviewed some files on her desk. She was very pleasant. She asked if I had any photos of my visit to Ukraine. I dug into my suitcase full of documents and produced some pics. That was all and she issued temporary Green cards for my wife and her son.

We immediately went across the Peace Bridge into Canada for lunch to try them out. Avery pleasant time...

The next day I came home from work to bad news...the "very next day"!!!

The Doctor has informed the family that the Mother is now dying from pneumonia and has 3 days to live!!! My wife of course must return to Ukraine immediately...

What!!!???

I am of course crushed by this news but also of course I must act...

I am in debt up to my ears and the best plan I can come up with is to use Aerosvit since they are the most reasonable and now I must go further into debt. They only fly to Kiev 2 days a week so the immediately thing is out.

Also, now I ask how long? We don't know. She wants me to pay all expenses plus the funeral.

I tell her bottom line if she needs to stay beyond 1 or 2 weeks that I will be limited financially and if it will be long term she may need to find work there to help us out...she is very upset at this and wants me to pay the whole shot...

I can't. Especially because of the timing...the day after the Green Card!!! This is too bizare. Please...what is up with this??? She gets a Green Card and the next day her Mother is dying??? I don't believe this but I have not told her so...I did write to her in Russian and she still refuses to write me back, even to confirm my understanding of the situation...

I will get tickets for her and her son and I can come up with $500.00 cash. The tickets will be one way I think since I don't think "open ended" tickets are available...

As always your insight will be greatly appreciated...

RK


Posted by: Kathy

Tell her you will make the arrangements with open ended tickets for her. But tell her you are going with her as well, as you are a family, and should grieve together. If this is a scam (which is what I read as an undercurrent in your post), she will not want you to go.


Posted by: Chrismc

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kathy
Tell her you will make the arrangements with open ended tickets for her. But tell her you are going with her as well, as you are a family, and should grieve together. If this is a scam (which is what I read as an undercurrent in your post), she will not want you to go.

That is good advice Kathy.....I agree with her RK.....it may give you the answer you are looking for.

Surely any wife would want her husband at her side at such an important, emotional and stressful time?


Posted by: skinsfan

correct me if i am wrong...but you just recieved a conditional 2 year greencard, not the 10 year greencard......3 days to live ?? strange amount of time.......it sounds like she is sucking you dry....i only have info that you write...that being said, if it were me, i would send her with 1 way ticket....i would not send any money to pay for the would be funeral.....IMO it is time to stop the bleeding......good luck...


Posted by: Kathy

What if her mother does have pneumonia and is near death?

I can understand all of this woman's reactions if her mother is ill. She feels guilty that she can't be with her. She feels responsible because, perhaps, if she had remained in Ukraine, her mother would not have fallen ill. In a marriage built on trust, this would not be an issue. In a marriage built on love, spouses would support each other and yes, would not balk at paying for the funeral, even if it puts the family in debt.

I know personally, I needed my husband's support on the death of my Grandmother (God rest her soul), and he mine, when his father died (God rest his soul). This is normal in a true family.


Posted by: skinsfan

it is so difficult when offering advice....it is not so easy for people to understand the situation completely....we can only respond based on the information we receive albeit one sided......IMO, if all what RK has posted is accurate, then it appears that he is being played. again, we only have his posts......language is so important.....because of the non-communication....who really knows the truth......but it appears that the reception of the green card, and the impending death of his mother-in-law one day later...well, it simply smells to me.........


Posted by: Justjohn

Although I have not commented before I have been following the thread from the beginning, and I can’t help but agree with some of the forum members, it seems to me from what I read you are being played, and being played well.
There seems to be quite a few things that don’t sound right to me. I honestly hope I am wrong , and I would be the first to say so if I was. Great point from Kathy about you going too she will soon put a stop to that if the illness is untrue.
I truly hope things get better
John


Posted by: rk288

Does anybody know the cost of a funeral in Ukraine???

She tells me she needs $4000.00...I my estimation that is about 1 years pay for an above average job over there. Can this be true???

She has 1 son here and 2 older sons there; one of them lives with her Mother and cares for her. I try to explain to her that between the 5 of us we should be able to deal with this situation somehow. She becomes upset and explains that as the husband I should deal with it because it is so immediate...

I have no immediate resource to come up with $4000.00 by tomorrow...

RK


Posted by: Texas Proud

RK...

YOU are the only one who knows enough to know if it is a scam or not.. talk to your friends and family and get their take on what they think..

But, here are some questions I would want to know..

Has she done other things to make it seem that she only wanted a green card??

Are there things she does to make it look like she is NOT interested in the marriage???

What caused the pneumonia (sp??) it does not just come up without some cause.. and why only three days to live? Is she old?? It is not a major killer unless you are old..

What does she get by going back home???? Nothing in my opinion... I would think she would prefer to stay, get a job and then say goodbye if she wanted to scam...

Maybe YOU are not as committed as you should be... just a thought.....


Posted by: Kathy

An average funeral would not cost $4000 in Ukraine. Nowhere near that amount. Where did your wife live? Is her mother in the city or in a village? Is your wife ostentatious?

As for pneumonia, it is quite common for the elderly, particularly when they become bedridden, and is often a secondary infection which causes death.


Posted by: rk288

Where do you get your infomation? Can you substantiate this some how to me???

I have gone online to search this question and came up with information that the government provides pensioners with a certain amount for funeral expenses. I showed this information to my wife and she became angry with me saying it is not true...

Her Mother is 74 years old and a victim of a paralysing stroke...pneumonia isd to be expected...

RK


Posted by: rk288

My wife is from Dnepropetrovsk and yes she is very "beauty" conscoius but also for the past 4 months very dedicated to our house and the necessary chores. Even now she is doing laundry and today she worked in the gardens...everything is perfect and clean...she worked hard in Ukraine and she works hard here. She quite often has complained about the wait for the Green Card as she wants to work and tells me that she wants to repay her debt to me.

As a family 2 weeks ago we all went wilderness canoe camping which my son and I do 2 times per year in the summer. It was a reasonably good time even though she insisted on her own sleeping bag as opposed to a queen size mattress which I did not understand...I like to sip wine by a campfire and she says "you very strong sleep"...I snore...I do this at home too...what's the difference??? I don't know...

Anyhow the 3 night trip was fine for me and all of us I guess...she had no complaints about it even though it rained when we got there and on the morning we were leaving it started to rain at 4:00 AM straight down, no wind, raindrops the size of quarters...our campsite was a swimming pool...

She did complain to her son in Russian about the fact that the zippers on my 30 year old tent were broken but she never said a word to me about it...I only overheard the conversation...

I live with this tent, it works and there are never any bugs inside...we were dry in the tents but everything else was soaked and nobody wanted the blueberry pancake breakfast planned for that morning even though I told them (including my son) that I would cook it...not bad for a "city girl" I thought...she was still "distant" though...no affection, no sweetness...no kisses, no hugs...duty???

Our next camping trip is to the Canadian wilderness...these are not easy vacations for the uninitiated...a lot of work, a good work out...my son and I love a good workout and this is our favorite time of year.

This woman did not marry a slouch. I am 56 years old and I weigh just a little more than I did when I graduated from high school. I can't run a 4:56 mile anymore, more like 7:00...I work hard and I don't have time for that much training...

RK


Posted by: Kathy

I didn't make my last post clear. I didn't mean if your wife is concerned about her physical appearance - most women are - but whether she is ostentatious in displays of wealth, a "keeping up with the Jones" mentality. As in the West, in Ukraine, there are individuals who would go the whole nine yards to impress others.

I know about this because my husband is from Kyiv and we both have many relatives living in Ukraine. Four thousand dollars is slightly more than a year's average wage in Ukraine, so there is no way a funeral costs that much, though I have no doubt one could spend that much - just as one could spend $100,000 on a wedding in the US. In Ukraine, it is expected that the family will pay for the burial. If your wife has siblings, they also should be expected to help pay for a funeral. Ukrainian tradition calls for a big dinner after a funeral, and if the family is religious, there is also a big donation to the Church. But food is pretty cheap in Ukraine.

The government does provide Ukrainians with burial funds, but you have to keep in mind that Ukraine is very corrupt, its government is in flux, and that providing the funds could easily be denied by bureaucrats who know your wife is in the West. This is a country where teachers and agricultural workers have not been paid for up to two years.


Posted by: rk288

As I write this we have one way tickets and They leave tommorow at 2:00 AM.

Recall the discussion about money...it ended up that I was able to get $500 from the bank which I gave to her and then I went in to the vacation fund and took out half...$200 more.

Tonight I came home from work, checked to see if all was packed and the ticket confirmations had arrived by overnight from my agent...all was well...

I checked the vacation cash fund...empty...missing...

I have not yet asked about it but I will before we leave...


This is a first...never any missing money before...

I have scheduled an Infopass meeting for Friday morning...

RK


Posted by: skinsfan

rk.....i hope all is okay with you......it is a good idea for the infopass...hang in there !!


Posted by: Kathy

I told my husband your story. He said there is a scam which is very similar to your story - immediately after receiving a green card, the wife's mother becomes ill and she must return to Russia/Ukraine immediately. She needs $3,000-$5,000 for expenses. That money is used to live in the US after she "returns" to the motherland. When the husband tries to contact his wife in Russia/Ukraine, his mother has no idea where she is. With a green card, they can work, so they leave and work somewhere. The plane tickets are cashed in.

I hope this is not your situation, but thought I'd pass that along.

Edit - PS - If you have any joint bank accounts, I suggest you empty them. If your wife (or her son) have any credit cards which you have any liability for, cancel them. There may be nothing of this, but if there is, better to cut your financial losses as much as you can.


Posted by: rk288

Dear all...

Wednesday, 2:00 AM we leave for the airport...3 hour early check in for international flights...not a pleasant time...not much said...

I found that she had taken her birthday presents, a ring and a diamond bracelet...I had told her the night before that it would be better to celebrate when she returns given the circumstances...

She had searched the house while I was at work and found these gifts where they were well hidden...I didn't say anything...

We arrived at the airport to find that they were not open for international check in for another hour and a half. We stood at the ticket counter. They spoke to each other in mostly Ukrainian I think since I know a lot of Russian and I did not at all get the gist of the conversation.

Her son sat on the bagage check in at the counter and at one point there were tears falling straight from his eyes onto the floor. I believe his Mother sternly but kindly corrected his behavior...

I thought about just leaving, it was so uncomfortable and rude...I went outside to smoke but came back in...it was my responsibility to see them safely off.

We finally did check in with some difficulty so I am glad I stayed. Then I walked them to the final clearance point...her son's eyes were red from crying but they were sincere. I took his hand in both of my hands and smiled a farewell. I touched my wfie's elbow as she moved on...she looked at me and said "spaseba" as she proceeded through the checkpoint.

She turned to look at me several times with nervous eyes as they passed thru. Each time I held up my hand to wave and she waved back to me.

I went home and received a phone call in English "Hello it's me we are at Washington, bye"...she very rarely spoke to me in English...that was the last I have heard from them...

One complication...I had purchased international cell phones for all of us when they arrived in March. The problem; the two phones for them did not have international roaming permission which I found out 2 days later. So, when they arrived in Austria they could not have called me...

I have called and sent emails...nothing, no news, no replies...

When I was at home over the next few days I discovered that my refridgerator had been cleaned out...cold cuts, all cheeses and 4 pounds of frozen butter!!! I just discovered the butter tonight as my son and I had dinner with corn on the cob...

One more thing...I don't know if i mentioned it but while my wife was here I gave her $1100.00 cash as her money over the few months. While we were discussing expenses for this trip I asked her if she had held any of it in reserve. She said "no". Upon returning from the airport I checked my vacation fund again. This is money I sent aside each time I go to the bank for cash. It is always new, crisp, $20.00 bills. When I checked it there were old 20's and many not so crisp bills...she had lied to me without question...

what has happened??? A new scam or did I simply not have enough money for this woman and she was insulted by me? I think I will never hear form her again...what is my next step??? The infopass was useless...12 minutes...they have nothing to do with anything of this nature...

RK


Posted by: Cheburashka

Wow! I am very curious how this will play itself out. Please keep us posted.


Posted by: rk288

I have been in this "adventure" for over 2 years now...scammed twice and now a third time after a marriage??? Has the sincerity of the Russian Woman gone sour??? Even to the point of bringing a child into a scam for a few hundred bucks and a 3 month vacation in America???

Don't get me wrong, there were very pleasant times and those were very pleasant, inexpensive vacations with fine women (translators who took care of all the details)...

I live in New York State and I couldn't have gone to Albany for the price I paid for these vacations...airfare included...

For the vacation I would do it again but I am missing something here...a message???

What mistakes have I made???

What is the message??? Money talks and BS walks???

I'm sure that if I was a Millionare with unlimited resources that I would not be writing this. Especially in the case of a 50 year old woman with a 19 year old son. I felt safe in this scenario. It's not like I wanted a girl in her 20's or even 30's...I searched for a contemporary...was this a mistake as they are to stoic and set in the ways of the "old culture"...

Culture and societal differences were always an issue in this relationship as was the case in the previous meeting...q.v. "Just back from St Pete"...

For this trip I hired a translator and made certain that my message was clear. That was that for the first 1, 2 or 3 years it would be difficult. I am not a wealthy man, I make a good living, we will be comfortable. Good food and a nice house, vacations and pleasant holidays...

I only promised it would be difficult for this time and that I could "help", not provide all...we did not even get past the point where I had to "provide all" in the transition...

I am still in the adventure Cheburashka...I think I'll stay...I am a Scout as my father was and my son is...we will go camping in the Canadian wilderness next week. I wish the whole family would be here to go along with us...it is better than the Adi"rain"dak wildeness by far...even if it does rain...

RK


Posted by: Cheburashka

Quote:
Originally Posted by rk288
I am still in the adventure Cheburashka...I think I'll stay...I am a Scout as my father was and my son is...we will go camping in the Canadian wilderness next week. I wish the whole family would be here to go along with us...it is better than the Adi"rain"dak wildeness by far...even if it does rain...

RK


I believe we should always think on the good things. When you are enjoying the majesty of the Canadian wilderness, remember this: you could be in Texas where it is flat, parched, brown, and 100F outside.

Keep on keepin' on!


Posted by: rk288

Dear All...

Here is the update...

I believe this was a scam and still could be...

There have been communications with my wife in Ukraine. She is there and I have confirmed this with a call back and several emails.

Her main concern is demanding that I send her "her" Green Cards and some clothes she left behind.

I have talked with my attorney. My attorney instructed me to tell my wife that I will send her papers of divorce to sign and when I receive them I will send her clothes to her.

She ignores this and continues to demand the Green Cards and her clothes and after that she will sign the divorce papers.

Most recently she has threatened me that she will approach the "American Court" to demand her Green Cards and her things she left behind.

Which "American Court"??? In Ukraine???

Does anyone have any insight or experience into this situation?

It is obvious to me that she only wants the Green Cards. Immigration has informed me that I cannot cancel them. I have them in my possesion here since she left with only the temporary stamp in her passport...I will not send them to her unless the US Government threatens me with legal force...

Did I tell you that on the day she left she placed a 1 minute phone call to New York City which I did not know about until I received the phone bill???

It remains a very bizzare situation...any help?

RK


Posted by: firemansam

Quote:
Originally Posted by rk288
........She ignores this and continues to demand the Green Cards and her clothes and after that she will sign the divorce papers.....


Can't send 'em if you can't find 'em....

Dear Ex-wife,
Sorry, I do not know the location of your greencards. Are you sure you did not send them to New York City?
Maybe you try to find them there?
Realy wish I could help,
Oh, by the way, say hi to mum for me!
Rk.


Posted by: Kathy

I think you should just send her the green cards.

I highly doubt she wants to return to the US. But perhaps her son does wish to return.


Posted by: Spakoyna

I would never send her the Green Cards! I would take the sissors to them or throw them in the fire! Kathy! Ya think he should let her come back under these circumstances...then maybe have a medical problem or go on welfare and he has to foot the bill for it????


Posted by: rk288

Right Spakonya...my fear exactly or even worse she could return and run up a huge debt which I would be responsible for. Or, all of the above...

But what about her "American Court" threat? Or, is she bluffing? I can't imagine there is an American court in Dnepropetrovsk. There's no Consulate there...she would need to be in Kiev at no small expense to her...

Any more thoughts?

RK


Posted by: skinsfan

if it were me, i would wrap the GC's in a zip lock bag, place them in a coffee can, and bury them near one of your favorite camp sites.....but that is just me........, but i would never send them to her...never !!


Posted by: Spakoyna

Quote:
Originally Posted by rk288
Right Spakonya...my fear exactly or even worse she could return and run up a huge debt which I would be responsible for. Or, all of the above...

But what about her "American Court" threat? Or, is she bluffing? I can't imagine there is an American court in Dnepropetrovsk. There's no Consulate there...she would need to be in Kiev at no small expense to her...

Any more thoughts?

RK


RK If I was in your situation I would consult with a lawyer...perhaps it's not too late to annul your marriage. If the 2 of you divorce she has no right to be here IMHO. From your side of the story there was no good faith in a relationship. If she gets permanent status you will be responsible for any expenses our government gives her until she has worked for 10 years paying Social Security.
I must say I really feel for you. I just can't understand how so many people have become so bad in our world. Sorry you had to meet up with one of the bad ones.


Posted by: Kathy

Had your wife been a scammer, she would have waited for her green card before leaving you.

Your wife is entitled to her green card. Were she to visit the American Embassy and say she never received her green card, she likely would obtain a replacement.

I can understand you are hurt. However, when I read the last post (when you took your wife to the airport), I understood why she left. And it was not due to a scam. I think to refuse to give her the green card is not worthy of a man of any decency.

If you are concerned about her running up debt, commence divorce proceedings, but I still believe the decent thing to do is send her the green card.


Posted by: ira156

Rk, there are a couple of things here that just dont gel, from both sides. Why do you have her green cards...they are hers. And why is she worried about them so much if her mother is dying. From my own personal experience in lossing both of my parents...people handle death or approaching death of a parent in very funny ways. just send the green cards, if its a scam then its already over and if she is legally entitled to them she will get them anyway.

If this had of been me i would have asked with concern about her mum and wanted to know what hospital she was in so ( you could send flowers ) or even say you were going to get an interpreter to assist your own doctor to enquire if there was anything that could be done. If she if she was not forthcomming ,,,,,BINGO. it all seems a bit surreal to me ...but good luck. Cheers


Posted by: Spakoyna

RK has her Green Cards because she left before they were delivered. Am I correct RK? I am also curious...did you do the advanced parole travel documents?


I think Ira and Kathy you are being a bit tough on RK if you read what I read in this thread.


Posted by: Kathy

I agree with ira - there are two sides to every story. I don't think I was hard on rk. And ira was very polite and downright diplomatic.

A scammer would not leave before her green card had arrived. Nor would she leave her clothing.

I really think the intransigence says a lot.


Posted by: waiting123

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kathy
I agree with ira - there are two sides to every story.


Actually, there are 3 sides to every story. His side, her side and the truth


Posted by: ira156

Quote:
Originally Posted by waiting123
Actually, there are 3 sides to every story. His side, her side and the truth

Hear Hear Cheb, and sorry Spak if i seem to have come over a bit strong, i didnt think i was taking either side here. I wasnt aiming my remarks at RK with regards to the green card thing....more so the responces from some other posters. They are her cards. And RK do you have any contact with the son....he may be able to shed a little more light on the subject for you??? As i said people handle these death situations in very weird ways sometimes ( if this is really the case). If her Mum really is dying i would just try and offer support it what will be a very difficult time for her. Cheers Mate


Posted by: firemansam

Quote:
Originally Posted by waiting123
Actually, there are 3 sides to every story. His side, her side and the truth

True but 99% of the time the third side will never be known except by the two who fight for > 50% of the outcome....
Hence, two sides of the story....


Posted by: Spakoyna

Quote:
Originally Posted by ira156
Hear Hear Cheb, and sorry Spak if i seem to have come over a bit strong, i didnt think i was taking either side here. I wasnt aiming my remarks at RK with regards to the green card thing....more so the responces from some other posters. They are her cards. And RK do you have any contact with the son....he may be able to shed a little more light on the subject for you??? As i said people handle these death situations in very weird ways sometimes ( if this is really the case). If her Mum really is dying i would just try and offer support it what will be a very difficult time for her. Cheers Mate


Actually they are probably property of the US Government.Perhaps RK should return them to immigration? I believe she is not planning on returning to RK or she would not be asking for him to ship her the rest of her clothes. Somehow RK does need to verfy or refute what is going on with her mom. Even if it means a trip over!


Posted by: firemansam

Quote:
Originally Posted by ira156
.............If her Mum really is dying....

If this were the case, she would well and truely be pushing up the daisies if the time line of this thread were true..
Hence my comment of if you cant find them.....
Otherwise, sorry ducky, for assuming you were dead and that your daughter was trying to rip of RK.


Posted by: rk288

Yes, the green cards are her property but how did she obtain them? I say fraudulently by deceiving me all the way...

No, I don't speak with her son...he's the one who told me lying is a good thing...when I asked him to clean the family computer he made it 10 times worse...

She has the temporary GC stamp in her passport so I did'nt need advance parole...

In time of crisis when you love someone don't you cling to them for strength? Instead she was manipulative..."you are not a man if you don't buy me this $1800.00 bracelet for my 50th birthday"...then she searched the house, for it and the $750.00 ring I had for her and made sure she took them with her along with all of the other jewelry. The things she left behind were insignificant and I had paid for most if not all of them...I had sent money for driving lessons and international licenses for both of them. She said "OOps, I spent it all on clothes and things for our trip to America...you are not angry with me?"

There's just so much that is wrong with this picture...I could go on and on...

RK


Posted by: ira156

Quote:
Originally Posted by rk288
Yes, the green cards are her property but how did she obtain them? I say fraudulently by deceiving me all the way...

No, I don't speak with her son...he's the one who told me lying is a good thing...when I asked him to clean the family computer he made it 10 times worse...

She has the temporary GC stamp in her passport so I did'nt need advance parole...

In time of crisis when you love someone don't you cling to them for strength? Instead she was manipulative..."you are not a man if you don't buy me this $1800.00 bracelet for my 50th birthday"...then she searched the house, for it and the $750.00 ring I had for her and made sure she took them with her along with all of the other jewelry. The things she left behind were insignificant and I had paid for most if not all of them...I had sent money for driving lessons and international licenses for both of them. She said "OOps, I spent it all on clothes and things for our trip to America...you are not angry with me?"

There's just so much that is wrong with this picture...I could go on and on...

RK

Ok i owe an appolgy, i didnt take into account the timeline as Sam has pointed out. And i know from personal experience that a person of that age when they get Phenumonia goes one way or the other really quickly.

I still dont undrstand if the whole thing was for the Green card and the mum wasnt dying why she didnt just wait a few more days? If they are the property of the US gov. just send them back with a letter of explaination. Tell her if she needs them to contact the relevent Gov dept. Sorry but its still a bit surreal to me.


Posted by: Kathy

Quote:
Originally Posted by waiting123
Actually, there are 3 sides to every story. His side, her side and the truth


Truth in relationships is always subjective.

rk - I initially gave you the benefit of the doubt. However, how many times since your wife left did you call her? IM her? Write her? Ask her how her mother is? How much money did you send her for living expenses while she was in Ukraine? Did you ever ask when she's coming back? Ask when you should buy a return ticket? Answer those questions and then ask yourself why she is asking for her green card.

If you had behaved the way you describe here with an American wife and her son, do you think the outcome would have been any different (other than the fact she wouldn't be asking you for her green card!!)?? I'm not suggesting your wife is blameless, but you should take responsibility as well.

You can believe this was a "scam", and you have since the first post in this thread (I went back and reread the thread). You had no trust in your wife almost from the moment she arrived. Do you think she didn't sense this? Don't you think she was humiliated by your attitude?

As for the jewellery (which is at odds with your previous posts, wherein you stated you were really cash strapped), if your wife cleaned the house, she likely would have discovered these items and they were intended for her, were they not? Plus, many Ukrainians, particularly outside of Kyiv, are very "show offy", and she'd want everyone to see what her husband gave her.

You claim to be a Christian, but your attitude is not one of forgiveness. You won't even send your (soon to be ex?) her green card. While I can appreciate the fact you have other financial obligations and that you are hurt, you could certainly take care of the former and act decently as well.

It seems to me you married a woman without really having a place in your heart and your soul for her. And rather than look at your own role in the failure of your marriage, it is much easier to assume you were scammed.


Posted by: Spakoyna

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kathy
Truth in relationships is always subjective.

rk - I initially gave you the benefit of the doubt. However, how many times since your wife left did you call her? IM her? Write her? Ask her how her mother is? How much money did you send her for living expenses while she was in Ukraine? Did you ever ask when she's coming back? Ask when you should buy a return ticket? Answer those questions and then ask yourself why she is asking for her green card.

If you had behaved the way you describe here with an American wife and her son, do you think the outcome would have been any different (other than the fact she wouldn't be asking you for her green card!!)?? I'm not suggesting your wife is blameless, but you should take responsibility as well.

You can believe this was a "scam", and you have since the first post in this thread (I went back and reread the thread). You had no trust in your wife almost from the moment she arrived. Do you think she didn't sense this? Don't you think she was humiliated by your attitude?

As for the jewellery (which is at odds with your previous posts, wherein you stated you were really cash strapped), if your wife cleaned the house, she likely would have discovered these items and they were intended for her, were they not? Plus, many Ukrainians, particularly outside of Kyiv, are very "show offy", and she'd want everyone to see what her husband gave her.

You claim to be a Christian, but your attitude is not one of forgiveness. You won't even send your (soon to be ex?) her green card. While I can appreciate the fact you have other financial obligations and that you are hurt, you could certainly take care of the former and act decently as well.

It seems to me you married a woman without really having a place in your heart and your soul for her. And rather than look at your own role in the failure of your marriage, it is much easier to assume you were scammed.


Perhaps you have not read and understood this thread as I have. But I must ask as I don't remember! Are you Russian or Ukranian? You seem to support the actions of those who have the bad traits from there. Of course I have not heard her side of the story but have witnessed what RK has described. For some FSU women there is always a greener pasture. Or once this cow has been milked there is another in the pasture. I am fortunate as I have a wonderful relationship with my wife. In the beginning my wife's expectations were a bit unreasonable...but with time she began to understand the big picture, the longterm thing...alias just because we have money doesn't mean we need to spend it as we need to protect our future! Your view of this situation seems to me to be very one sided with the bad FSU attitude to me.


Posted by: rk288

Kathy,

You bring me to recollect the many live conversations I have had here with my friends and relatives...I wish we could also speak as spontaneously but unfortunately this resource is a thread of incomplete information. It is a very valuable resource to me however for the past 2 years.

We have spoken on the phone several times although we do not anymore. My wife left on 8/9 and I think it was 8/21 when I finally heard from her. I immediately sent her email and tried to call her right after she left.

This is strange, when I finally did hear from her she told me her Mother died as she was travelling on 8/9...another guilt trip...there were many, many guilt trips and how many times was I told I was less than a man if I didn't buy her this, do this for her...etc...from when they first arrived here...nothing was good enough. I tried and I went into debt for trying...

I think I wrote the answer here that you are guessing but I don't have time to look...you wrote that a funeral in Ukraine costs nowhere near $4000.00...I sent her back all expenses paid with $700.00 cash in her pocket.

Since she arrived in America I had given her and her son allowances of $1700.00 total for her and I think about $400.00 for her son (it is more than that but that is what I show in my budget reports on the computer). I asked her before she left if she had kept any of this in reserve. She said no. When I returned from the airport that morning I checked my cash fund. I was all there but the new 20 dollar bills had been replaced with older bills. I only save the new 20's in this fund...

She left here with more than 3 months salary and several thousand dollars worth of new jewelry.

Also missing was several pounds of unopened packages of cheese, butter, yogurt, cold cuts and toothpaste (4 tubes)...

When I lost trust for my wife was the weekend before she left right after receiving the temporary GC stamp in her passport. That weekend was hell and it shouold have been a time filled with "I love you...", hugs, tears, anticipation...

When they arrived in March she had a large envelope addressed to someone in New York City that she said was a friend of her Mother's. She asked me to post it for her which I did without question and without noting the address. She was always inquiring about NYC and was dissapointed when I could not take her there during the summer while her Mother was ill. Instead of my son's and my already planned camping trips she and her son wanted NYC. Another guilt trip from both of them...a major pouting session...instead of a $200.00 camping trip I was supposed to provide a $2000.00 trip to NYC.

When the tickets arrived she was shocked and upset that they did not travel through NYC, instead Washington...

There was a 1 minute phone call to NYC the morning she left which I was unaware of until I received the phone bill at the end of the month...

I trusted her until the end game where many bizarre things played out...it is not strange to you that her mother is dying suddenly the day after the GCs are given???

Yes, my wife cleaned the house. Do you think I would hide her birthday surprises in a place that needed to be cleaned??? No, they were burried where no one would think of looking. I have a 12 year old son...where do you think I put his special presents around Christmas??? Her gifts were much better hidden...

Yes, they were her gifts. The bracelet was the result of a guilt trip...

I married and welcomed 2 strangers into my life and my house and my family at great expense. I was continually made to feel inadequate and insufficient. I tolerated this behavior up until the last weekend when I really began to feel that I had been used.

Then the weeks that followed and now the demands for the GCs and insignificant clothing that I bought for her. What does she want to do with the GCs???

I would be happy to talk with you by telephone if you still have unanswered questions...

I am not offended or upset at all by your questions. I hope this reply fills in some other blanks left in the thoughts of my other friends here...

RK


Posted by: Kathy

No, I am not a FSU woman. However, I am of Ukrainian descent and lived in the FSU. There, I saw it all. More than you can ever begin to imagine. And, incidentally, others here have posted that I have been "negative" about FSU women, so it is all about perception, isn't it? And you don't know this woman, so how can presume to know she has bad traits?

What I have read on this thread (and yes, this is my perception, coupled with my knowledge of Ukrainian culture) is someone who never expected good from his spouse. The fact he was even on this forum, very early in his marriage, asking if she could be a scammer is not a good indicator for a long term marriage.

A scammer would not be stupid enough to leave her clothing, or take off before her green card arrives.

You can believe what you wish, and as I've posted, a failed marriage is always the fault of both parties, but put yourself in that woman's position. She has three children, which already makes her pretty unusual in terms of FSU women, particularly of her generation. This also suggests she is family oriented. She left her sons, likely grandchildren, and her mother to make a new life with a man as a life partner. And what awaits her when she arrives?

How would you like to give up everything that is familiar to come to a home where you are watched by the only person who is supposed to love you, and have your actions second guessed by someone who is not looking for the good in you? Would you feel loved by a spouse whose idea of good communication is writing you a note rather than speaking to you directly, as imperfect as verbal communication may be? Who walks out on the porch and waits for you to come out, rather than asking you to come out and sit with him? Who doubts you when you tell him your mother is ill and needs money to be taken care of? This is especially egregious in Ukrainian society, where mothers are almost revered and respect of one's parents is very strong.

Is this the type of life you would want, particularly in a foreign country where you don't speak the language and rely solely on the love and benevolence of your spouse?


Posted by: Kathy

I cross posted with you, rk.

The attitudes you describe are not unusual among certain FSU women. I suspect your wife didn't contact you immediately because of her mother's death.

As I posted previously, I don't believe everything is your fault - failure of a marriage is always a 2 way street. But I still think the decent thing to do is send her the green card. It doesn't mean she'll obtain permanent status, and in the end, you will have done the right thing.

If you're concerned about alimony or debt, deal with that beforehand.


Posted by: Spakoyna

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kathy
No, I am not a FSU woman. However, I am of Ukrainian descent and lived in the FSU. There, I saw it all. More than you can ever begin to imagine. And, incidentally, others here have posted that I have been "negative" about FSU women, so it is all about perception, isn't it?

What I have read on this thread (and yes, this is my perception, coupled with my knowledge of Ukrainian culture) is someone who never expected good from his spouse. The fact he was even on this forum, very early in his marriage, asking if she could be a scammer is not a good indicator for a long term marriage.

A scammer would not be stupid enough to leave her clothing, or take off before her green card arrives.

You can believe what you wish, and as I've posted, a failed marriage is always the fault of both parties, but put yourself in that woman's position. She has three children, which already makes her pretty unusual in terms of FSU women, particularly of her generation. This also suggests she is family oriented. She left her sons, likely grandchildren, and her mother to make a new life with a man as a life partner. And what awaits her when she arrives?

How would you like to give up everything that is familiar to come to a home where you are watched by the only person who is supposed to love you, and have your actions second guessed by someone who is not looking for the good in you? Would you feel loved by a spouse whose idea of good communication is writing you a note rather than speaking to you directly, as imperfect as verbal communication may be? Who walks out on the porch and waits for you to come out, rather than asking you to come out and sit with him? Who doubts you when you tell him your mother is ill and needs money to be taken care of? This is especially egregious in Ukrainian society, where mothers are almost revered and respect of one's parents is very strong.

Is this the type of life you would want, particularly in a foreign country where you don't speak the language and rely solely on the love and benevolence of your spouse?


I will wait for RK to reply to this. Obviously there are 2 sides to this story. I have taken to the side of RK because if what he has posted is the truth then I hold with what I have posted. I did this because you have taken the other road in his wife's defense.


Posted by: Spakoyna

I forgot to say...if her passport is stamped I believe she can return without her greencard....so why does she want him to send her greencard???????


Posted by: Kathy

I haven't taken anyone's "side". I merely pointed to the fact there are 2 sides to every story.

And rk - the call to New York was probably to the mother's friend.


Posted by: rk288

Her passport is stamped. She is free to travel the world...

Why does she want the Green Cards so badly??? What about the NYC issue???

Why do I have no communication or details about her Mother except the guilt trip that she died while her daughter was desparately travelling to be with her??? Melodramatic was her middle name...guilt trip was the game for gain and she did gain alot now she wants all of her treasures in her hands again at my expense...I don't think so...

I would have at least expected some family pictures at the dinner after the funeral if not many other details about what was happening...

When I visited her she isolated me, locked me in my apartment that she rented for me and took the keys. Her friends were all not available and her Mother suddenly became ill that I wouold take her daughter from her...I don't even know if she has a Mother...

She was so sweet and inocent...

Kathy, I would like to speak with you by phone...spontaneously to answer all of your questions...I don't think it can be communicated here...

Cell phones work for me...what is it, *65 blocks all identity...

RK


Posted by: rk288

Spakonya,

My wife never did understand that "big picture" but always pouted about a bigger picture...more, always more and then pouted if she didn't get it...

One night we went for a walk past a house that was for sale which was bigger than my house...she wanted it and was dissapointed that I could not buy it for us...

And so it was...

RK


Posted by: ira156

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kathy
I haven't taken anyone's "side". I merely pointed to the fact there are 2 sides to every story.

And rk - the call to New York was probably to the mother's friend.

Hey Rk, I am one who has accuessed Kathy of being anti FSU women yet i have some agreement with her on this. Well the mother really was dying, as i have said people handle these situations in strange ways. She may have felt partly responsible think she had left her mum then she got ill and wasnt there to care for her.

The whole Green card thing has still got me baffeled. If she has been granted the green card ( from what i read ) she can come back to the US any time she wants anyway. She just has to go to whatever Gov Dept say she lost it and get issued a new one. And it is her name on it isnt it. I dont think she would of convieniently planned the mothers death to coincide with the green card being issued.

The new $20 old $20 thing, well she obviously ( or the son ) used the money. But she did replace it. If she was just ripping you off she wouldnt have put it back at all. Yes she should have told you.

I am a person that buys gifts very often for no reason. I often get " oh thanks so much you didnt have to" to which i say "no i didnt i wanted to". I would never buy a gift ( wife or not ) under demand. For me a gift is given for thanks, thanks for making my life better. I dont buy a gift so that she will make my life better. You were blackmailed by her saying " if you dont you are less of a man" i am sorry Rk but ( in my personal opinion ) you became less of a man by by doing it. Any woman that would try and lower my self worth for the sake of a few hundred dollars, i would say good bye. We are not talking about money for improving her edjucation, or work prospects, or even to help her keep the home ....we are talking trinkets.

If you want to salvage this i would only suggest to start talking. I will say from experience that you cannot acuse Kathy of being bias for FSU women. Hi Kathy Cheers Mate i hope you get the result you sre after


Posted by: rk288

Hey ira,

Yeah, I know, I'm weak...same as you though...I buy gifts for no reason. She pulled the 50th birthday guilt trip on me knowing that I already had bought her a gouorgeous ring which i had showed her after she laid another guilt trip on me...then I hid it again...did she want me to just keep giving her these gifts without waiting to open them???

I like surprises and I like to wait for that special day...

I think you misunderstood the $20 thing...she obviously had old 20's in her possesion and traded them for the new 20's. She didn't steal any 20's from me but she lied to me when she said she had not held any of her cash allowance in reserve.

RK


Posted by: ira156

Quote:
Originally Posted by rk288
Hey ira,

Yeah, I know, I'm weak...same as you though...I buy gifts for no reason. She pulled the 50th birthday guilt trip on me knowing that I already had bought her a gouorgeous ring which i had showed her after she laid another guilt trip on me...then I hid it again...did she want me to just keep giving her these gifts without waiting to open them???

I like surprises and I like to wait for that special day...

I think you misunderstood the $20 thing...she obviously had old 20's in her possesion and traded them for the new 20's. She didn't steal any 20's from me but she lied to me when she said she had not held any of her cash allowance in reserve.

RK

RK, i hate giving opinions on problems with "marriage" as only you and your wife know the full story, and they are usualy different depending on who you talk to. I suppose the question really is. Do you love her? Find out if she loves you and then do what you have to one way or the other. I hope things work out mate.


Posted by: zumanity

I am just a plainspoken person but I kindly ask you not to use the term FSU women.
And not to generalize about women from different areas. I am not going to read this thread any more, since it makes me to change religion



Posted by: ira156

Quote:
Originally Posted by zumanity
I am just a plainspoken person but I kindly ask you not to use the term FSU women.
And not to generalize about women from different areas. I am not going to read this thread any more, since it makes me to change religion

Hey Zum, if they are women from the Former Soviet Union, what are we supposed to call them. This is no way a derogitory term, just as saying American or Australian woman. I think most people here to agree and often state that there are good and bad ( men and women ) everywhere. If you say Russian women someone jumps in and says that their partner is from Ukraine or moldova belarus ect ect. Hence the term FSU. I thought that was the whole purpose of the site....Russian ( FSU ) meeting place. Cant tell if you are having a dig or a joke Mate.


Posted by: firemansam

Quote:
Originally Posted by rk288
.....I married and welcomed 2 strangers into my life...........

Here lies the problem as far as I can tell from your tale....


Posted by: firemansam

Quote:
Originally Posted by zumanity
I am just a plainspoken person but I kindly ask you not to use the term FSU women.
And not to generalize about women from different areas. I am not going to read this thread any more, since it makes me to change religion

I agree with Ira, they are FSU women just as I am an Australian man. That you take offence to this term? Very strange... Maybe you should just change your religion as you suggest and then you will be able to cope with the reality that these women are from the FSU and as such, they are FSU women...


Posted by: zumanity

ira156: Why would we just say Russian Women and the Rest. One R would be for the rest( Moldova, Ukraine..)

Cant tell if you are having a dig or a joke Mate
P.S.
-(with a hursh voice..)
"Do not seek the treasure'
O Brother, where are thou?


Posted by: markgm

Quote:
Originally Posted by zumanity
ira156: Why would we just say Russian Women and the Rest. One R would be for the rest( Moldova, Ukraine..)

Cant tell if you are having a dig or a joke Mate
P.S.
-(with a hursh voice..)
"Do not seek the treasure'
O Brother, where are thou?


Zumanity can i ask why the term (FSU/W) former soviet union women offends you.


Posted by: nocomfortzone

Quote:
Originally Posted by rk288
.....I married and welcomed 2 strangers into my life...........


Quote:
Originally Posted by firemansam
Here lies the problem as far as I can tell from your tale....


Exactly!
*Strangers*
What is marriage? and what are strangers?

What is the saying, we teach people how to treat us.

People can be their own worst enemy or best friend

choices, choices choices!!


Posted by: zumanity

Quote:
Originally Posted by markgm
Zumanity can i ask why the term (FSU/W) former soviet union women offends you.

i was under impression of
A General Interpretation of a FSU Woman
http://russianmeetingplace.com/foru...92327#post92327 or vise versa..


Posted by: bobjf

Quote:
Originally Posted by zumanity
i was under impression of
A General Interpretation of a FSU Woman
http://russianmeetingplace.com/foru...92327#post92327 or vise versa..


mate i spoke to my russian wife about this & she can't see what the problem is
fsu simply stands for former soviet union & refering to a woman from there is saying she is from a part of the former,where is it offensive
it's same as calling our girls rw's , rg's or rf's
i certainly don't see any reason to get uptight about it
if the is a reason then please state it


Posted by: zumanity

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobjf
mate i spoke to my russian wife about this & she can't see what the problem is
fsu simply stands for former soviet union & refering to a woman from there is saying she is from a part of the former,where is it offensive
it's same as calling our girls rw's , rg's or rf's
i certainly don't see any reason to get uptight about it
if the is a reason then please state it


you still don't get it, do you? The offensive part is what you guys write.
Please read "A General Interpretation of a FSU Woman" .
and note his wife is also FSU and she let him write that BS.

Let's just close this subject


Posted by: firemansam

Quote:
Originally Posted by zumanity
... I am not going to read this thread any more....


So I am assuming that you still do read this thread and yet, you are offended by the term FSU?
Why not take your own advice and stop reading?
You my friend are either a glutton for punishment or you are trying to pick a fight. Either way, if you do not like the term FSU (which is where these women live!), then maybe you are participating in the wrong event?


Posted by: ira156

Quote:
Originally Posted by zumanity
you still don't get it, do you? The offensive part is what you guys write.
Please read "A General Interpretation of a FSU Woman" .
and note his wife is also FSU and she let him write that BS.

Let's just close this subject

HeyZum i think it is you that doesnt get it. Most of us here do not agree with the " a general interpretation of a FSU woman" post, and have said so. If it is that post that offends you .......YES I AGREE!!!!!! But i am getting the impression that just the term FSU bothers you. Again why? Our ladies are from The Former Soviet Union. If we were on a site that had mainly, Thai, malasian, indonesean ladies we would be saying Asian....or if they were from france, italy and germany we would be saying European. Look at waht most of the replying posts to that thread have been and you will see that most are defending our lovely FSU women. I think its a bit of political correctness going overboard. Zum refering to that thread, MOST OF US ARE ON YOUR SIDE.


Posted by: zumanity

Quote:
Originally Posted by firemansam

So I am assuming that you still do read this thread and yet, you are offended by the term FSU?
Why not take your own advice and stop reading?
You my friend are either a glutton for punishment or you are trying to pick a fight. Either way, if you do not like the term FSU (which is where these women live!), then maybe you are participating in the wrong event?

It's a perfectly fine event for me. I am checking just to see how far you guys can go~

2 subjects are very much related. You bring huuuukers here from all over FSU and then cry over the Internet asking for an advice "What to do with Ukrainian wife who locked me in a "closet"." See above
Trying to play an victim instead of mentally challenged

or another one... for 9 years in Russia he was hanging out at night clubs/bars mingling with losers like himself (not even trying to learn some russian language) and then writes "A general ideas about FSU women".
Sure previous (FSU) experience makes him an expert.

Quote:
Originally Posted by firemansam
"you are trying to pick a fight."

oh, no. I just see that you enjoy having conversation with me*

P.s. Anything else???


Posted by: firemansam

I would like to point out your original complaint.....
Quote:
Originally Posted by zumanity
I am just a plainspoken person but I kindly ask you not to use the term FSU women.

Now maybe I am wrong... But the women we are talking about in this forum live